Ed. Note - I’m an Edu fan, but yeah, I agree with most of this post. Though I always thought GvB was talented and his play at Barca shows this. He just wasn’t a good fit for the Arsenal…
So why are we hearing nightly about the ongoing saga of Edu’s contract negotiations? I like him, he’s been a nice replacement player for the boys when they were low. He has even scored some nice goals for us. But is he nightly newsworthy? Look at the midfielders we have now. RP7, FL8, PV4, FF15, GS19, etc… When you are being replaced by a 17 year old, albeit a precocious and extremely talented one, that should be an indication that you are not all that and a bag of chips. I think his flirtation with the Brazilian national team has inflated his ego, and fellow countryman Gilberto should break it down for him. Sit down, shut up, and enjoy the ride E-dork!
Side-note: this feels like a bit of deja vu, anyone remember Giovanni van Bronckhorst? I think his resurgence has caught a few by surprise in Barcelona. But, I think that was a rarity.
36 Responses to “Edu or e-don’t?”
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December 28th, 2004 at 9:33 am
Hmmm…I rate Edu, but you make some interesting points.
Any EPL player with a little Brazilian International cred is liable to get some press. But lest we forget, it was a significantly reduced squad when he figured in their recent Copa America victory (first, though, since 1999). Still, he’s dangerous on form and I would love to see him out there one more time.
But if he wants to go, I won’t be too broken up. I still go by the adage that EVERYONE wants to play for The Arsenal (that’s right, even you Nevilles, you freaks). No one leaves unless they’ve been more or less nudged or replaced.
Unfortunately, when someone is out for awhile, unless they’ve dominated in their position, the blush tends to fall off their rose pretty quick. Kind of a shame.
December 28th, 2004 at 9:47 am
By the way, you have to hand it to our team for the way they bend over backwards for our players. Edu benefitted quite a bit from Wenger’s diligence and benevolence, and got more help than some teams would have been willing to give.
For example, Mutu was dead to the team when he got busted. Look, substance problems are nothing new, and I understand zero tolerance, but The Arsenal stood by TA cause we got love for our guys. They’re not just utility. Mutu made his own bed, but I don’t remember any kind words of encouragement from the Chelsea camp. Though I’m willing to accept that I simply refused to listen.
And speaking of Chelsea (as we all do lately) I mentioned in another post that I heard a rumor that their physios picked Gallas up off the field, limped him out back, and shot him. Does anyone know if this is true?
December 28th, 2004 at 12:21 pm
uh-oh! straight to the glue factory!
December 28th, 2004 at 12:42 pm
I’m just bothered that a guy who was vehemently kissing the crest last season turns down two contract offers. It looks like Flamini can fill his boots nicely (and is so young), so I wouldn’t mind too much if he doesn’t step on the pitch for Arsenal again. Face it though, any sort of rumour that deals with Arsenal, Chelski or ManUre is news in this 24 hour news age.
I always thought van Bronckhorst was quite good, he just lacked the physical presence that’s needed for a defender in the Prem (I have the same concern with Clichey, but he’s still growing).
December 28th, 2004 at 1:49 pm
Rubbish !!!!!!!!!! what a whole lot of crap..
There is one thing Edu did which the so-called captain PV could not do. As I always say football is all about money now and there are only 3 real gunners in the current Arsenal team.
All that the guy is asking for is a better pay deal and don’t see anything wrong with that.. PV did the same so is Sol, Cole, JP. Show or tell me one player who don’t want a better pay deal if they think they worth it.
Come up with some facts instead of crap chat about the bloke.
Back to football.
December 28th, 2004 at 1:56 pm
Kissing the crest is another form of crap or modern art by players. They all do it. Remember my best mate Sol when he was a spurs player. Rooney statement that a blue will always stay a blue.
Not to forget the club cpatain. Wasn’t he kissing the fcuking crest and at the same time thinking about joining RM.
December 28th, 2004 at 4:05 pm
Don’t remember much crest-kissing but hard to forget him wrapped in a Brazilian flag during last year’s celebrations when everyone else was wearing something Arsenal. It looked to me like he was keeping his distance and proclaiming that his first love and loyalties weren’t with us. He’s been a useful player, especially last season, but I won’t be that sorry to lose him.
The ones I am worried about are
(1) Lauren, who isn’t being offered the four-year contract he wants.
(2) Gilberto, who almost since the beginning has had a lot of stick from the fans. Unlike Edu, he has never been popular - though god knows he’s been skilful, hardworking and loyal. Hard to imagine he isn’t unhappy. Hard to blame him if he decides he’d rather be somewhere else.
(3) Reyes. He was warmly welcomed by the fans when he first came, but already, after less than three months below-average performances, people are starting to get on his back. He is miserable in England, and even in football terms things have gone progressively more and more wrong. First he wasn’t picked for the national side; then he was - and must have wished that he hadn’t been. I think he’s potentially brilliant and an important player for us. I really hope the fans are patient. Otherwise, if he starts getting slagged off like Gilberto, it could be the last straw. I’m sure he’s longing to go back to his beloved Servilla, and look where they are in the table. They’ll probably be in the CL next season, so they’ll need to strengthen their squad.
Miranda
December 28th, 2004 at 4:19 pm
Gilberto had hinted about wanting to play in Spain some time. Never heard him gripe about wanting to be elsewhere, though.
Lauren is no spring chicken. He has to be realistic.
Question: If you were Wenger and Real offered $15 Mil. for Reyes, would u take it?
December 28th, 2004 at 4:49 pm
Well Sol took a paycut to stay. But he’s english, and top english players don’t just move abroad - unless its Real Madrid. That’s the advantage of having local boys in the team.
December 28th, 2004 at 4:56 pm
No. I wouldn’t.
I believe Reyes will come good next season.
Would you pick up James Beattie on the cheap!
December 28th, 2004 at 6:25 pm
Point taken; there’s just one goal celebration where Edu ran around the pitch waving his one arm around and pulling the crest to his mouth with the other that looms large in my memory (can’t remember the match). In retrospect it seems like he was milking it a little, especially with how vocal he was about wanting to get into the Brazilian team. Ah, hindsight.
Still so hard on Vieira though? The guy stayed put!
But as you said, back to the football…
December 28th, 2004 at 8:52 pm
Sol did not take a paycut but lost his massive signing on bonus still he joined the club as a free agent. And you right the english guys will alway stay in england unless they are going to joined a big club like Juv, RM or Barce. Someone said on the radio, sometimes at Arsenal you have to be french to get you way or forget it.
My point was you can’t blame Edu for asking for more money knowing another big club wants him. Tell me one player who will not jump the ship knowing a better club wants him with more money.
And when I read he was no one before joining Arsenal as the article turn to say who was PV before joining Arsenal. So before ppl start writing article about players let get the balance right and some facts to go with it.
Again back to football.
December 28th, 2004 at 9:08 pm
The Answer to your question is buy or spend money in Jan. Buy King off spurs and do it now. I remember back in October when I said Arsenal should buy King but stagg was not having it. The guy is better than cygan 2 million times. He can play alone Sol and KT can replace Lauren. And if liverpool don’t make it to the CL next season buy their captain.
But the point is all players like me and you thinks about ourselves first. So I don’t see the reason for the crap chat about Edu esp. after making his views well known to the club. Is up to both parties to sort it out or not. So let give the poor bloke a break.
December 28th, 2004 at 10:26 pm
I’ll take $15 Million for Reyes IF we can use it to get Defoe. I’d take him over King. Under Wenger just imagine what he could be!.
December 28th, 2004 at 10:30 pm
I’ll name one. Henry!!
December 28th, 2004 at 11:02 pm
Love_G…
I tip my cap to you… we could certainly use Ledley King.
I 100% agree on Gerrard as well. I wouldn’t care if it cost 30 mill. GBP. He would be the cornerstone of the team for years to come.
I have no problem with Edu wanting more money. Its natural. If he wants to play in Spain, I’d understand that. It will get sorted either way, and we have many midfielders of his caliber.
December 29th, 2004 at 1:30 am
love_g… why so hostile? read my post again, i was not derogatory in any way toward edu. i even said i like him. no crap chat here. can’t you agree that he’s not one of the main focus players on the squad? with all of the injuries, migraines, and suspensions in the midfield , he still hasn’t broken through to consistent first team action. that’s my barometer right there. if AW doesn’t think he’s capable, i don’t think it’s solely b/c he’s not french!
let him go to another club and we’ll see his mettle tested. we can use the $ saved on a player that can help us on the field, not on the tele.
December 29th, 2004 at 10:38 am
First off I don’t think we would get 15M for Reyes and in any event Wenger believes in him and thats enough for me. This reminds me of when Henry first arrived, I remember thinking he may be the worst finisher I had ever seen. Would anyone sell him for 15M now? Arsene knows attacking talent Reyes, will come good. As far as King vs. Defoe we don’t have a problem scoring why dont we do something to stop us from conceding bad goals. Our defending is the reason we are not leading the league not our attack.
December 29th, 2004 at 11:29 am
I said exactly that sclarke… Henry certainly didn’t start well at the Arsenal, but we all know he has blossomed into the best… Reyes will be just fine.
December 29th, 2004 at 11:44 am
I think it’s still too early to make that kind of decision on Reyes, much of his worth will be on display during the away matches in the Champions League when we’re minus Dennis. Many of the other European teams won’t be as physical with him as teams in the Prem. Arsene has even commented earlier that he expected Cesc and Reyes to help them out in the Champions League a lot this season, tipped his hand a bit there.
December 29th, 2004 at 11:45 am
Hey Stagg…didja read Henry’s comments about how he’s proud we’re in contention cause of our youth sytem and not through wads of cash. He goes on to praise Cesc and the youngsters, and then in the next breath says that he would have quit if Vieira left, citing that we wouldn’t have won anything without him? He more or less said it would have shown him what our aspirations were.
I say, “what about that big, fecking stadium going up cross town, dude?”
Kinda had our boy Titi bagged as a Gunner do or die. Buggers.
December 29th, 2004 at 1:33 pm
He’s just rapping. He prob means if we’d sold PV.
Wish us luck on Reyes. He’s brilliant, no doubt, at his peak as good as Maradona. How often do we see that peak? How long do you suffer a player of whom you really never know what to expect? One minute he’s dribbling through half the defense, the other he can barely stay on his feet. Still think if it wasn’t his price tag he’d be benched ages ago. Even he has said as much, that he feared being benched. And why shouldn’t others get that same chance, like those who came up through the youth system. Will Bentley for example get that chance, or has Pennant?
I’ll take Defoe anyday. He’s brilliiant, Henry Mini. Just look at his tally playing for a team like Spurs.
December 29th, 2004 at 2:43 pm
When I talked to Thierry, I told him how I back Vieira on this site at every turn… and he said he’d do the same publicly.
!!!!!!!!!!!!
If Titi said that… then I love it. It shows me that the team backs Vieira and believe in him, regardless of what some supporters feel. They need Vieira and need him to be at his best. I’ve said it all along. This team is a CLOSE KNIT bunch, and its part of why they succeed.
YOU TELL’EM THIERRY!
December 29th, 2004 at 3:59 pm
1-0 Arsenal at the half, due to a VERY nice shot by Paddy…!!!
December 29th, 2004 at 5:17 pm
I’m loving these 1-0 victories. A team that can win 1-0 can win anything. Funnily I don’t have the same sense of deja vu I used to have when we lead by a goal. Something about Manuel?
December 29th, 2004 at 5:27 pm
I would think its more likely SOL being back in shape and in form… and Vieira in the middle doing a better job defensively on set-pieces.
2 SHUT-OUTS IN A ROW! No Set-Piece issues at all.
Cue up the 1-0 to the Arsenal song….
and then …
why not the Vieira song too…
December 29th, 2004 at 6:29 pm
Van Persie? Shades of Jeffers, I started to feel in the second half. The same effort, the fluffed chances, the look of desperation, the nearly lost temper … It’s not that he played badly exactly but things didn’t go well for him - which comes to the same thing. Maybe I’m just grouchy because I keep putting him in my Guardian dream team, thinking Now’s the moment, now he’s going to start scoring! Only to have to sell him again the next day. I hope he’s not another Kezman, a great talent at home who hasn’t worked out. OK, I know he needs time but for skill I’d go for Lupoli even now.
Miranda
December 29th, 2004 at 6:37 pm
This is the same argument as the Reyes one. You simply cannot have it both ways!!!!
You want the young players to get playing time, to get their feet wet, to get a chance in the 1st team. It is completely unfair to think that any of them are going to become stars overnight!!
Henry was not very impressive his first season here…. do you remember?
VanPersie and Reyes and Clichy and Pennant and Flamini and Cesc…. and ANY OTHER YOUNGSTER thrust into the team, will simply need time to develop at this level. The English game is not for the faint hearted. It takes time to adapt. There is no debating this issue. Its RARE that someone can step in and have instant stardom.
I am happy that he is getting playing time. Some of the kids are getting a good amount of time. This will have BIG positive benefits down the road.
Cut him some slack, please!
We won. 1-0. another shut-out. We ground out a win on the road at St.James Park. Vieira scored. I know its not a 4-0 blow out with lots of flash and style… but this is a VERY positive result.
December 30th, 2004 at 3:41 am
It’s 1 nil to the Arsenal. I love it when we win ugly. We’re grinding out the results and the defence is so much, much better. About Van Persie can’t expect him to start tearing up the Premiership. It’s a totally different style to the Eredivisie. He needs a run of games, to gel with his teammates and time.
December 30th, 2004 at 9:08 am
I think Cole played especially poorly. Not so much one on one with Bellamy, who can be crafty, but in tackles, his mouth, the handball, and just plane getting it wrong. He seemed ANGRY. You don’t play well when you’re overly pissy. Just ask Rooney. But I was thankful that he was intense.
RVP does need time, but he was the weak link up front. To his credit he was everywhere and always seemed ready to go forward, had a GREAT shot barely saved by Given that was curling into the near post beautifully, but he didn’t challenge well and he’s got to remember that he’s not Thierry Henry. Kudos for audacity, this is The AFC after all, but you can’t skid a ball up your shin and have it fall perfectly behind you at the foot of your strike partner when a) you don’t yet have the open play skill to do that, and b) there’s 10 men in the box. Still, I think he showed confidence and determination, but I just wish he settled the ball more and didn’t try and match the AFC fancy as much. All in all, still like him, and still think he’s going to be a monster if he DROPS the attitude.
We’ve really become that nuisance team that we weren’t in the start of the season. At the beginning we had the flow. Now, we just run teams ragged and into desperate hoofing. Even Chelsea was frustrated and should have lost. Defensively we won the ball again and again (despite the commentary, I though Bobby had a great defensive game), when we weren’t needlessly fouling (very sloppy at times). But we give it away very cheaply with this bouncey bit of passing trying to get through the five men midfield. The only time we were really dangerous was when we took our time, spread the defense, and made straight, smart passes. A little too anxious and tricky for my tastes, but at least I felt calm around set pieces.
Paddy…much better again, especially against a team that concentrated almost solely on disrupting the midfield. He also did well to take that shot at the death and got a bit lucky. But in our first half play we deserved it. Great in set pieces, as well.
Flamini. Steady, hustles. Getting better winning the ball. All over the field. Forget completely just how young he is, just like Cesc, who got a much deserved break. Looks like he and everyone started immitating Freddie at once out there.
Almunia will never get his due cause he looks a bit thick and no one rates him. But he’s getting the clean sheets (clever save early on) and making no stupid mistakes out of ridiculous bravado. He’s already got ten times the trust from me then Lehmann had the whole of last season, especially on set pieces. He just plays his a** off. Thank you, Manuel.
December 30th, 2004 at 11:09 am
Paddy appears to be winning over a few folks. A bit of good form and some hustle and grit can do a lot of good!
December 30th, 2004 at 11:22 am
Give van P. time. Just look at the raw talent, the eye for goal. And he stays on his feet, doesn’t he?
December 30th, 2004 at 11:28 am
Absolutely. Cesc is still terrific and gifted and getting the ball forward, but Paddy is intimidating people again and, at least in the last two games, not foolishly.
He looks like he WANTS to be top dog again. Maybe Cesc was a good thing for more reasons than his playing.
December 30th, 2004 at 11:33 am
Good point. I just hope he doesn’t keep knocking others off of theirs. But hey…breaking into top flight English football is gotta be a lot like your first few days in prison. Unlike Rooney, who is needless and thick with his temper, van P. is sending a message.
And I still haven’t forgotten the points he saved us at Southampton, of all places.
December 30th, 2004 at 2:29 pm
I don’t think Almunia looks thick, not like Edu looks thick! (Though it’s true Jens looks a lot more intelligent.)
Van Persie: I hope you’re all right that he simply needs time, that he hasn’t yet gelled with the team. No, Stag, I don’t expect instant stars, but I what I do look for in the young players is flashes of excellence. Reyes has shown them for sure; so have Lupoli, Flamini, Quincy and Hoyte (despite making many mistakes); so has Bently (though it pains me to say it as I think he’s a *****). But van P? I don’t see it, try as I might. I’d really like to have faith in him: could someone tell me what to look at - i.e. show me where his potential talents seem to lie?
Miranda
December 30th, 2004 at 6:27 pm
ScottyUS
Agree with you on Cole’s performance. While I am glad he kept Bellamy quiet for much of the game, his rush into tackles and mouthing off at every decision that goes against him are a cause for concern. I think it is OK to play with intensity but Cole seemed an angry man. If he continues at this rate, I would not be surprised he becomes the next Gunner to be sent off; and its been quite sometime since the last Gunner was received the red card. I hope Wenger speaks to him to channel his energy into his game and stay away from arguing against every decision that goes against him.
As for RVP, the boy needs more time to gel with the team. He has potential as he demonstrated with two good left footed attempts which required good saves from Given. From the games he started so far, he tends to start brightly in the first half before fading away from the game in the second. I think as he gets more experience with EPL defenders, he will learn to find more space to operate (and avoid having to take on 2-3 defenders at the same time). I am sure watching the Dutch master at close quarters can teach him a thing or two to get the better of EPL defences. If he continues to improve, I would not be surprised if Wenger decides to release Bergkamp at the end of this season.
I look forward to Reyes returning to form and Gilberto getting a start in the new year.