Champions League football is back again. Although, the almost month long wait feels like an eternity. That is because days after the joyous March 4 away win to Milan, things have not gone as per a happy script for Arsenal. Dropped points in the league before a loss to London rivals Chelsea threw Arsenal’s title hopes into a spin. Things appeared to get grimmer after 45 rain soaked minutes away to Bolton; the rain appeared to be drowning Arsenals’ promising season down the drain. Yet amazingly this young team took a page out of previous Wenger and even George Graham teams in able to turn a game around when there was absolutely no sign of hope. 3 second half goals, including a snooker like winning goal ensured that there is still some life in this young Arsenal team.
Liverpool come into this game on the back of an impressive 5 game winning Champs league streak. After a poor start where they only picked up 1 point from their opening 3 games, Liverpool turned things around when staring group elimination in the face by going on an amazing run of 8-0 (Besiktas), 4-1 (Porto) and 4-0 wins (away to Marseille) before their 2-0 home and 1-0 away win to Inter. Arsenal on the other hand started the Champs League group stages in the impressive manner as their league campaign — stylish wins and a handful of goals. Arsenal were impressive in taking care of a Juande Ramos Sevilla side 2-0 and followed that with a 1-0 away win to Steaua before turning it on against the new comers Slavia 7-0. With qualification in sight, Arsenal let their foot off the pedal and only managed a 0-0 away tie to Slavia and a poor 3-1 away loss to Sevilla cost them top spot in the group before their final 2-1 win over Steaua. However, top spot meant nothing as Arsenal outplayed and completely dominated the defending Champs Milan to reach the Quarter Finals. Liverpool also dominated their Milan opponents, although one can argue they only had to do it against 10 men in both legs.
Arsenal and Liverpool will get an intimate look at each other over the next week and their 3 meetings will go a long way towards deciding the outcome of both teams season. Which team will be left fighting for silver-ware and what league standing will each occupy when all is said and done? The questions should answering themselves starting on Wednesday. The final act of Arsenal’s 2007/08 is about to start and it does promise to contain plenty of action, drama and emotion. So grab some popcorn, some healthy beverage (water, malt, hops and yeast to bring it all together), find that favourite bar stool or comfy chair/couch and tune in. It shouldn’t be dull.
Disclaimer[in tiny print]: The producers of Arsenal’s 2007/08 regret to inform fans that there will be no financial or emotional refunds if Arsenal fans are not completely satisfied with the final outcome of the games. Also, the producers can’t offer any solutions to fans on how to cope with the emotional wreckage the next few weeks might cause. There are no help lines currently set-up.
96 Responses to “Arsenal vs Liverpool, Champs League 1/4 1st Leg - Sachin’s Take”
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April 2nd, 2008 at 10:07 am
Thanks for the disclaimer. I hope the help lines won’t be necessary.
Let’s do this! Liverpool have looked eminently beatable in their last two matches, and Torres evidently doesn’t like scoring when the Kop isn’t there to celebrate with him.
April 2nd, 2008 at 10:21 am
This is a MASSIVE game both in terms of momentum and strategy. We HAVE to take a lead into the second leg while keeping a clean sheet.
If we do that, Rafa the Rotator will field a 2nd string team for our League fixture this Saturday in order to rest his players for the 2nd leg knowing that they need to score. That would make it easier for us to get another 3 points for the league (I haven’t given up hope yet until it’s mathematically impossible)
I don’t think a goaleess draw would do it for us this time, because Liverpool lack the pace and energy that AC Milan did and will fight very hard at Anfield for a result.
A score draw or losing at the Emirates would be unimaginable, but we could always look back to the Italian Job we pull on Inter winning 1-5 away after dropping 0-3 at home. Let’s hope we will just get the job done in the 1st leg and take a 2-0 lead into the 2nd leg.
C’mon you gunners!
April 2nd, 2008 at 10:54 am
It’s a very hard game to predict - almost impossible over two legs. I’m not worried about Arsenal losing the match, but I am worried about conceding away goals. Arsenal have been looking shambolic at the back lately, and despite all the bravado in the papers, there’s no way the back four can be confident going into this game.
The team virtually picks itself, as it has most of the season. Adebayor has been off colour, but it’s not entirely his fault. Service from the midfield has been very poor. Adebayor is not Henry, he won’t score a goal out of nothing, but he will score if the team is fully functional, and the team hasn’t been fully functional for months.
Over two legs, Liverpool will be a lot tougher than AC Milan, I watched them against Everton on Sunday, and whilst they weren’t great going forward they are pretty solid at the back. With two defensive midfielders behind Gerrard, u can see Arsenal really struggling to break them down if Hleb or Fabregas are not on top form. As for Eboue, he’s a liability and will probably get sent off fighting with Mascherano.
I honestly couldn’t give a prediction - I’d be happy with 1-0 or 2-0. Any goal conceded would not bode well for the second leg, chasing the game there could see us get a hiding. We need to into that game with Liverpool being frightened to fully commit to an attacking game, that won’t happen if they get an away goal tonight.
April 2nd, 2008 at 11:32 am
Yeah jestanley, I am also hoping the disclaimer isn’t necessary.
neova, I was thinking the same thing if we get a good result, then I can see Rafa resting a players for the Sat league game. Heck, he might even start some players that I have not heard of like he did against a league game against Fulham (last year I believe). But that depends on how today goes.
April 2nd, 2008 at 12:18 pm
I got a feeling we will beat them both home and away. They are neither Chelsea or Man U.
Bring em on!
April 2nd, 2008 at 1:26 pm
True, they’re not. I think the only chance we have of beating them away is if we keep a clean sheet tonight. If we don’t get a fairly convincing result tonight then we’re out as far as I’m concerned. If I was Benitez I’d keep it very, very tight tonight and employ Crouch in the second leg alongside Torres. Crouch would murder us in the air - I reckon Benitez will bring him on at some point tonight to try and snatch an away goal.
April 2nd, 2008 at 1:58 pm
I’m still sticking to a 2-0 win - provided we fire on all cylinders.
If L’pool keep us out and frustrate us, I can see Crouch coming on for Torres for the last 15 mins and giving us some aerial bombardment problems.
But I fully expect this team to battle and push L’pool from the start, hopefully even rattle them enough to get a goal and force them to come out a bit in the second half. That said, Benitez is such a conversative tactician, he’d probably be happy with keeping it to 0-1, and certainly 0-0.
Victory tonight depends a few key performances. Hleb - our perennial curate’s egg - has to get into the last third and dribble and weave. Encouragingly, on Saturday, he both won the penalty and supplied the byline cutback for Cesc’s ‘pinball winner.’
It’s been a while since he’s been that far forward where he can do real damage. Also with VanP back and coolly despatching spotkicks, there’s extra incentive to draw some fouls on the edge of the area.
Clichy has to get forward and supply some testing crosses. L’pool’s centre backs are there to discombobulated by Ade and you could see VanP getting that bit closer to scoring against Bolton, i.e. he got into great positions and was hitting first time shots. All he needs now is to get his sharpness and accuracy back.
Ca va sans dire, Cesc and Flamini have to outsmart and out hustle L’pool’s midfield, which is a potential clusterfuck of nasty tackles. But the great thing about Gerrard is that, like Lampard, he can be made to have anonymous games, when he’s forced to do more defensive duties.
We can workrate this L’pool team into their shell because so often this season they’ve lacked a killer instinct. They don’t lose very often, but when they do, they tend to fold up and look lost.
On the other wing, if Eboue plays, who knows what to expect. Crazy overhit shots. Erratic crossing. Cringe-inducing theatrics. Lame penalty dives. Genuine penalties waved away because of the previous simulations. What is it with this anus? I guess every team has to have one.
Anyone, let’s hope this team lets rip a la Milan.
April 2nd, 2008 at 2:16 pm
Its very very tight to call. A few Liverpool fans seem to think that Benitez is going to stick with his best 11 though. If that happens and for some reason Crouch does not start it will be:
Reina
Carragher Hyppia Skrtel Aurelio
Kuyt Mascherano Alonso Babel
Gerrard
Torres
Plus if we play our best 11; it will be:
Almunia
Toure Gallas Senderos Clichy
Eboue Cesc Flamini Hleb
RVP Adebayor
Subs: Lehmann, Bendtner, Diaby, Song, Theo
Yes I know there are people who want Theo to start but I still think he’s best off the bench with his speed. And Eboue for all his stupid diving usually does quite well in Europe for some reason. I just wish he’d stop his dirty sneaky fouling and diving — its really sad to watch it and I hope he doesn’t win us a penalty by doing that.
Adebayor alone will be a handful for Hyppia and Skrtel..yes alone because RVP will play off him on the “wing” just like Ronaldo does. I’m not sure how to call this but I’ll go for a 1-0 to the Gunners.
April 2nd, 2008 at 2:25 pm
Squad’s up…got it absolutely bang on..both squads
. I’m the best…the greatest predictor ever…well whatever. I’m dead dead tired after a long day and now have to stay awake for another 2 hours..it better be worth it 
…. Please win guys. Help me have a nice 3 days ahead. Sorry…I’ve lost it…
April 2nd, 2008 at 2:44 pm
Bring on those Liverpool punks. I have started to be annoyed more and more by Benitez’s antics the last two seasons. And Torres annoys me in general. I want us to take the game to them - if we do that, we take them down. It is all about whether the Young Gunners have the mental toughness to stay on point and focused, because we have the physical skills to match with Liverpool.
And as a Fort Worth Texas resident, I want their owner Tom Hicks to be miserable - as he has ruined two sport franchises here in town.
Come on you Gunners! Kiss the Crest! Believe!
April 2nd, 2008 at 3:08 pm
What a time for Ade to score his first goal against Liverpool.
April 2nd, 2008 at 3:11 pm
Awesome. So far, it’s all going according to my cunning plan.
April 2nd, 2008 at 3:12 pm
Damn. Score early and concede early too. Very bad. Need to keep our heads now.
April 2nd, 2008 at 3:13 pm
fuck… can’t gift liverpool away goals like this… shit…
April 2nd, 2008 at 3:15 pm
fucking away goal conceeded!
April 2nd, 2008 at 3:15 pm
Sorry. I spoke to soon. 1-1.
We need two more goals to shut this lot up.
April 2nd, 2008 at 3:22 pm
Yaiks….I can see Pool scoring again…hopefully NOT.
April 2nd, 2008 at 3:24 pm
Arsenal have gone completely flat after Liverpool scored.
How did we let Gerard through like he was Henry?
April 2nd, 2008 at 3:27 pm
If it stays 1-1 then you know Rafa will play for a goaless draw at Anfield.
We NEED to take a lead into the 2nd leg. Anything less than 3-1 tonight won’t be good enough. You know Arsenal will concede at least 1 at Anfield so 2-1 won’t do….
April 2nd, 2008 at 3:29 pm
Common u gunners. We can do this.
April 2nd, 2008 at 3:32 pm
Bad first half. We haven’t put any kind of sustained pressure. When we did get the goal, we couldn’t hold on for more than 3 min. Need an improvement as we need at least another goal, if not more.
April 2nd, 2008 at 3:35 pm
We need TWO more goals. Because we can’t keep clean sheets at the moment, especially at anfield.
c’mon Wenger put Eboue back at RB and bring on Walcott now!
April 2nd, 2008 at 3:35 pm
Was Hleb on the pitch the first half?
April 2nd, 2008 at 3:36 pm
How predictable. Arsenal are playing like also-rans. They’re on the same level as Schalke or Fenerbache - they know they can’t win this competition, it’s written all over their passes.
April 2nd, 2008 at 3:36 pm
our defense is way too prone to mistakes.
RvP is not as sharp as he should be….if he was he would carry the team.
Hleb needs to stop dancing around doing nothing ……at least dribble ONE and CHARGE towards the box. right now he is just content sitting on the left wing and playing short passes.
April 2nd, 2008 at 3:42 pm
Hleb has confidence issues, he should not be first choice at Arsenal. Eboue shouldn’t even be at Arsenal, he’s the worst right midfielder I’ve ever seen at the club. If Arsenal can show enough character to take the game by the scruff of the neck and win 3-1, I’ll concede we have a chance - but 2-2 seems more likely.
April 2nd, 2008 at 3:43 pm
too many players not playing upto the level they can play to!
was heartbroken that our ascendancy lasted just 2 mins
seemed to lose the plot a bit after that, we need the arsenal from the bolton second half to come out after the break!
April 2nd, 2008 at 3:45 pm
Hleb does have confidence issues but so do most creative players, just hope the hleb i love comes out in the 2nd half!
April 2nd, 2008 at 3:50 pm
RvP out. Big blow. Could end our chances for the season.
April 2nd, 2008 at 3:57 pm
RVP is made out of glass. You can have all the talent in the world but if u cant stay on the pitch, it’s pointless.
April 2nd, 2008 at 4:02 pm
Walcott is wasted on the left and Hleb is not doing anything in the middle.
April 2nd, 2008 at 4:03 pm
I guess it is not his fault that he is injured all the time. Nobody wants to be injured.
April 2nd, 2008 at 4:07 pm
Hleb denied a penalty.
April 2nd, 2008 at 4:10 pm
HLEB ROBBED!!!!
April 2nd, 2008 at 4:11 pm
BLINDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD
April 2nd, 2008 at 4:12 pm
Bendtner make a goal line clearance from Cesc. It’s getting agonizing.
April 2nd, 2008 at 4:34 pm
Very disappointing result. Not the birthday gift I wanted.
In Europe, defense rules!!!
April 2nd, 2008 at 4:38 pm
A very good 2nd half. We were aggressive, ambitious, and totally dominated them. yet as said before, you can’t beat the lady luck, sure hell can’t beat the ref neither. i don’t wanna be called talking excuse, so let’s just say - it’s a very good performance from us at the 2nd half. in fact, i think Liverpool only taken…. well, did they actually have a single shot in the 2nd half?
but i guess that’s why they r so good in Europe. they can get completely outplayed yet still be able to get result.
April 2nd, 2008 at 4:40 pm
Liverpool were crap, even their goal was against the run of play and fortunate.
April 2nd, 2008 at 4:41 pm
rafa has this annoying luck in the CL its incredible.
we WILL score at anfield no question….but how many will they score?
April 2nd, 2008 at 4:41 pm
Disappointing …we played well but as usual failed to finish the game off.
Still believe that we can come back strongly at Anfield…but remains to be seen what Wenger does for the game on saturday. If we had Sagna and Eduardo in this team we would have absolutely smashed Liverpool [:(] ..well i guess it’s just luck
I don’t for the life of me know what Bendtner was trying to do…and nor do i know why that ref did not give that penalty. Hopefully we can finish it off on Tuesday.
Fehnerbache defeat Chelsea 2-1 …if Arsenal go out to Liverpool and Fenherbache are in the next roung..it’s going to be really disappointing
Hoping for the best.
Cheers,
Wayne
April 2nd, 2008 at 4:42 pm
Depends what you call outplayed. They had a game plan, let us have the ball, that’s not being outplayed. We all knew their strategy and it worked perfectly - defend, defend, defend, wait for Arsenal to commit suicide.
How many times did we test the keeper? You want to win the Champions League by penalty decisions alone? It’s not going to happen, besides, a penalty is not a goal.
They did a job on us, entirely predictable in my opinion.
April 2nd, 2008 at 4:43 pm
exactly nipuna, defence wins games. just ask george graham!
but the goal we conceded though, i don’t think we can really blame anybody. yet another match winning moment from Gerrard. like i said, he’s the man, not Torres, when things matter most.
his cross with such a pace, any touch would have sent the ball into the net, be it Clichy, Senderos, or anyone else. and it’s not like we didn’t have men marking him neither, in fact, we got two, but he beat them all. so what can u say? hat off to Gerrard for their equalizer.
April 2nd, 2008 at 4:44 pm
Catenaccio Merseystyle.
Advantage Liverpool.
We certainly had chances, but quite impotent we are.
Hleb is so bad it’s sad.
Ade on the flank of the box has no mox.
RVP is more like RIP.
And poor old Bendtner-tried to get out of the way of a winning goal-no dough.
Cheers go to Gallas for his play.
And, we certainly outplayed the Reds over the bulk of the match - or so some might think. But after it was 1-1, both sides had quite different objectives: Liverpool wanted to get out of town as is, and the Gunners frantically tried to attack and score.
Thus, it would obviously look like we outplayed them from then on - but we didn’t, because ‘Pool achieved their objective - we did not.
April 2nd, 2008 at 4:44 pm
arsenal deserved a win
ref is either blind or a liverpool fan
the boys turned up second half, we dominated most of the match except for the 10-15 mins following their goal.
hleb was excellent when he was playing thru the middle, sadly doesnt have a left foot.
if we play like the 2nd half we will get something at anfield
oh yeah and rafa and liverpool under rafa are a one trick pony, but god do they do perform their one trick well!
ps - if sagna would have played, doubt he would have got skinned like kolo…sigh…
April 2nd, 2008 at 4:45 pm
@Kiwi: Liverpool were not crap, it’s just that you don’t understand what tactics are.
April 2nd, 2008 at 4:45 pm
DannyT, well, u gotta admit, they were damn LUCKY tonight. Their gameplan could have easily got thrown out of window. The Hleb move was brilliant. So did the Theo cut back. And had not because of Bendtner, we could have equalized.
And u call that their game plan?
April 2nd, 2008 at 4:47 pm
Methinks Ade and Bendtner will have another bust up.
Even if Bendtner didn’t stop the ball going into the net, he would be called offside as he would be deemed “interfering” with play. Why he was there in the first place is beyond me. Stay ONSIDE kid!
Well, at least the message is clear for Arsenal in the 2nd leg - must start all guns blazing chasing for that away goal early on and keep the pressure on Liverpool to open up and let us counter attack.
C’mon gunners, i still believe in you even though yet again you’ve let me down somewhat tonight….
April 2nd, 2008 at 4:47 pm
Don’t try to be DIFFERENCE for the sake of it. Let’s talk about what we actually seen.
if our 2nd half performance couldn’t be called as “domination”, I don’t know what is?
April 2nd, 2008 at 4:47 pm
If we had a top striker there instead of Bendtner he would have let it go through his legs, it’s called awareness. I’m not blaming it all on Bendtner, but that’s what you get with kids. As I said, it’s called tactics, having a game plan. Liverpool said let’s keep it down to conceding 1 or 2, but make sure you get the away goal, that’s exactly what they did.
April 2nd, 2008 at 4:49 pm
leave danny alone…….if we do beat them at anfield suddenly he will say “oh, they are crap!”
anyhoo, lets just get 3 points on sunday.
April 2nd, 2008 at 4:49 pm
no neova, i think they called him offiside becaue he had a “touch” of the ball, had him not touching the ball, it wouldn’t be ruled offside.
but i wouldn’t really blame him, he probably couldn’t get out of the way that’s all. like Sendy, Ade, he’s a big man, so a bit clumsy.
April 2nd, 2008 at 4:49 pm
Andez.
Their game plan was exactly what they did.
Because we didn’t finish, it WORKED.
They got a draw and an away goal… we had all the possession, and they sat back and soaked it up… with their occasional HOOF down the pitch.
Lucky?
Sure. Whatever you want to call it.
Sometimes its better to be lucky than good.
They did exactly what they wanted at the end of the night.
They didn’t lose, AND they scored.
It is advantage Liverpool.
We can definitely get a win their… or a 1-1 draw as well.
Its completely game on.
Its not a big advantage they have now, but a slight one.
ALL TO PLAY FOR.
We just have to improve @ Anfield and finish better in the last third of the pitch.
April 2nd, 2008 at 4:50 pm
Domination doesn’t always win football matches Andez, we’ve seen it enough times at the Emirates. When the Italians ruled they were perfectly happy to let you have the ball - this mentality that domination is everything is nonsense. No point dominating if you can’t test the opposition keeper more than once in 90 minutes.
April 2nd, 2008 at 4:52 pm
If RVP is hurt for real, Wenger has a problem. Even without the goal-line foul-up, Bendtner contributed nothing today.
April 2nd, 2008 at 4:53 pm
gotta agree pool were lucky. -
walcott just missed with an exocet
hleb was denied a cast iron penalty
bendtner got in the way of the winning goal
fab with a late header straight at the keeper
yes their stratergy is to defend, but not to be lucky. what we saw today was bad luck for us plus some poor finishing/decision making.
April 2nd, 2008 at 4:55 pm
walcott just missed with an exocet - yeah “just missed”, how about not just missing
hleb was denied a cast iron penalty - a penalty isn’t a goal
bendtner got in the way of the winning goal - so, get out the way
fab with a late header straight at the keeper - not enough pace on the cross, shearer wouldn’t have scored that
April 2nd, 2008 at 4:56 pm
poor Bendtner…
he was carried by the momentum of his attempted header and couldn’t do anything about blocking the shot.
and the penalty not called…
April 2nd, 2008 at 4:57 pm
They did their job tonight. Nick an away goal, and tire us out for the next two matches.
April 2nd, 2008 at 4:57 pm
honestly i think the talk of tactics is crap. wenger or arsenal werent outdone by anyones tactics, we were let down by our own poor finishing.
@Andez: gerrard’s effort was great, but a better right back would have dealt with that.
April 2nd, 2008 at 5:02 pm
@danny my point simply being the reasons none of those moments were goals had nothing to do with liverpool or their “tactics”, rather our own shortcomings or bad luck (penality, near miss from walcott). so i dont think pool deserve much praise, they play bland boring predictable football. they drew coz they were lucky end of!
April 2nd, 2008 at 5:10 pm
Indian Gooner, I’m with you. Their tactics look decent now, but only because of a massive dose of luck and Arsenal’s poor finishing. I don’t think Rafa Benitez “planned” to have his side survive a clear penalty scare. Or have we all agreed he’s that much of a tactical genius?
In the end, though, Pool have got what they want and all the weight is on us to bounce back. It ain’t over yet.
April 2nd, 2008 at 5:13 pm
Catenaccio is a tactic - a stragety - a viable strategy - a strategy that can work (see Italy and big Italian clubs) and worked for Liverpool tonight.
Our play was a mirage - it never materialized into anything in the second half.
We ran more kilometers than the Reds and we had the ball almost the entire second half it seemed.
But it was a mirage - nothing happened.
Every match is full of near misses.
But, I argue that tomorrow, if you watch this match again, without the intoxication of the moment, you will see what Liverpool did to us.
April 2nd, 2008 at 5:21 pm
@thompson gunner no doubt liverpool defended well (mascherano was really really good), which was their strategy as well. despite this they had a lot of luck to thank for the draw, without which they would have easily lost 2/3-1 …thats my view at least.
sendy and gallas looked comfortable together, a lot diff from tourre and gallas. Though I feel tourre was in a way responsible for the pool goal ..
April 2nd, 2008 at 5:21 pm
haha, what’s so SPEICAL of their TACTIC? u going away in the 1st leg of a CL tie, you don’t have that offensive force like ur opponent, so what u r u gonna do? Sit back and defence, keep it tight, try to nick an away goal. u don’t have to be a professional manager to understand that!
and to defend, there are two options - (1) close opponent down all over the pitch, stop them play OR (2) sit deep in ur own box, let them have the ball in area don’t harm u.
Liverpool opted for the 2nd option. how brilliant a GAME PLAN!!
only difference is - we CAN’T PUT THE DAMN BALL INTO THE NET.
if we did, the same brilliant TACTIC would be a rubbish one.
well, since u guys refused to criticse the ref, yet enjoying to criticse our players. And since the fact that the scorebox says 1-1. so i guess u guys are right - yeah Liverpool got the result because of their BRILLIANT GAME PLAN!
April 2nd, 2008 at 5:21 pm
So thats todays story.
Liverpool were lucky.
A massive dose of luck?
Seriously. Get over the Arsenal blinkers thing.
They did WHAT THEY WANTED.
April 2nd, 2008 at 5:26 pm
Plain and simply we have been figured out.
It is obvious that teams are not threatened by our width. The best way to beat Arsenal or confine them, is to restrict their play to passing around the box.
WE HAVE NO CREATIVITY
Until we get some…not many positives will come out of this season. By no means is this a criticism, rather it is an obvious problem in the style of play. We are entirely to slow for a decent counter. Once the other team gets back, we ALMOST NEVER take a long range curler or stinger. We pass it around and hope that a slick pass will unlock the defense. IT WONT! This is not pee wee football.
April 2nd, 2008 at 5:27 pm
@Andez:
Rafa clearly knows that Arsenal can’t put the ball into the net - thus his approach. It is a gamble, because yes were are capable of scoring 4. But Liverpool did not break - they did bend, but didn’t break.
Catenaccio is not pretty. It’s effective given the right circumstances - and Rafa knows how to play a team like ours in a 2-legged European tilt.
@ Indian Gooner:
Agreed that ‘Pool got some luck - the ball bounced their way in some critical moments.
April 2nd, 2008 at 5:27 pm
ofcourse they were! which side got away with a cast iron penalty????
thats all the point is pool were lucky (no ones denying that their strategy was to defend or that they did that pretty well or that they are in the box seat or that they got the result they wanted!), which i am sure their fans would agree to as well. am shocked so few arsenal fans seem to be willing to agree to the same?!
April 2nd, 2008 at 5:29 pm
All viewpoints are entirely relative - we agree to interpret it differently
April 2nd, 2008 at 5:30 pm
Cast Iron Penalty?
Sorry. No it was not.
It was a debatable penalty.
In games that big, it shouldn’t be called, IN MY OPINION.
Play On. Stand Up, instead of diving and rolling around on the pitch.
You can’t HOPE for a penalty.
April 2nd, 2008 at 5:30 pm
Hey - I was also screaming at my TV when Hleb was pulled down…
April 2nd, 2008 at 5:32 pm
@stag133 : we’re just going to have to disagree with that one then. I think its you on one side and the rest of the football watching and playing world on the other :p
April 2nd, 2008 at 5:36 pm
luck luck luck, what a load of drivel - it’s the same every year.
You really think that 12 years of dismal failure in the Champions League is all down to luck and nothing to do with tactics. You are living in dreamland and full of excuses.
What about that shot that Almunia spilled, was that bad luck for Liverpool that he managed to grab it at the second attempt.
Arsenal played fairly well tonight, but you need a lot more than playing fairly well to win the Champions League. Face it, the team is young and inexperienced - it’s a decent team, but at the business end of the season it has fallen short. Has nothing to do with luck whatsoever. If you want to win football matches you need to create 5 or 6 CLEAR CUT chances and bury 1 or 2, and you have to keep it tight at the back at home. Arsenal are incapable of this.
How do you think a team like Liverpool made 2 finals, winning one - tactics, that’s how. They beat superior opposition by playing just like they did tonight. When a team keeps doing that it is not down to luck.
The problem is too many people here are biased and don’t think logically, whereas myself and a few others can still fully support the club yet be realistic. Year after year after year Wenger teams have underperformed in this competition, put it down to bad luck if you like - for me this was same old, same old Champions League Arsenal.
April 2nd, 2008 at 5:37 pm
fab and tourre were they players who let down the most today i think
April 2nd, 2008 at 5:38 pm
For me it was a clear penalty, but again, a penalty is not a goal. Someone has to step up and score it in a pressure cooker environment. Fairly or unfairly, you need to do more than hope penalty decisions go for you.
April 2nd, 2008 at 5:42 pm
“@Kiwi: Liverpool were not crap, it’s just that you don’t understand what tactics are.”
Sure if the outcome is all you care about, they used a tactic, they did a job on us, but they still served up crap football.
April 2nd, 2008 at 5:43 pm
@danny “Arsenal played fairly well tonight, but you need a lot more than playing fairly well to win the Champions League” - simple question, do you think liverpool played “a lot more than fairly” well tonight?
I agree we have been poor in this competition historically, though I think Arsenal MKIII is far better at the CL than previous versions, and we’ve had quite a few “European Glory Nights” in the past three years, with some big scalps to our name, am hoping for one more glory night at anfield…
April 2nd, 2008 at 5:44 pm
The played well according to their game plan. Is it pretty to look at? No. It’s crap to look at. If Arsenal had played like Liverpool did tonight you’d all be saying we played well.
April 2nd, 2008 at 5:45 pm
gotta agree with Kiwi as well, they play horrifically boring stuff. Someone earlier called Arsenal predictable and “figured out”, no side is more “figured out” or predictable than liverpool..that doesnt stop them from winning games ofcourse, which is to their credit
April 2nd, 2008 at 5:46 pm
In fact, to illustrate my point, Arsenal played exactly like Liverpool did when they got to the Champions League final - one up front, 4-5-1 defensive. Don’t remember anyone saying it was crap football then.
April 2nd, 2008 at 5:47 pm
Ade’s goal was great, hope was back. But then within a few minutes, argh….Gerrard called for the pass back, pointed to where he wanted the ball and danced his way into the penalty box. On first look, I thought the ball took a deflection off Gallas and went in, but it was 1-1, Liverpool had their away goal.
I can’t see how the ref didn’t give a penalty for Hleb. On the weekend, in the French cup final, a penalty was given for a similar pull back. Frustrating. Kuyt gave the thumbs up to his fellow Dutch ref for getting the right decision as far as Liverpool were concerned. But this is the not the first time, a penalty was not given for Hleb. So what do refs think that Hleb goes to ground easily? But still, the team had a chance to score a goal. Maybe Bendtner might be answer for Arsenal’s future defensive woes as he seems to have more of an instinct to trap & clear the ball as opposed to playing a dummy and letting the ball run through.
The Cesc-Van Persie corner routine was tried a few more times after the opening goal. On one occassion, the two got mixed up with Van Persie showing his frustration to Cesc on what he had wanted, with Cesc replying back. The Bendtner clearance also had him explaining his actions to Cesc. Yet, while the debating went on, Liverpool were more than happy to sit back and simply watch things unfold.
Frustrating yet again. Regarding Van Persie. I can’t believe he got injured again. Speechless regarding that.
Well the Sat game won’t be easy. Liverpool will come wanting something from the game, probably sit back and frustrate Arsenal. Even though Liverpool gift league games to Man U, they will try to fight with Arsenal for something on Sat.
The CL tie isn’t over yet, but Liverpool do hold the advantage. Arsenal must win on Sat, and then try to get an early goal at Anfield, because Liverpool will be quite content to sit back, sip some coffee, let Arsenal players run around, sip some more coffee, sit back some more. But if Arsenal score, then the coffee will be on hold and Liverpool would have to attack.
April 2nd, 2008 at 5:47 pm
@danny: so did arsenal, what differentiation one’s result from the other was luck, at least thats my opinion.
And if Arsenal had played like Liverpool tonight I’d be saying the same thing, Arsenal were lucky…
April 2nd, 2008 at 5:49 pm
No you wouldn’t, if Arsenal went to Anfield, played like that and got a 1-1 draw, you’d be saying that Wenger is a tactical genius, and this is what you need to do to win the Champions League even if it’s not pretty blah blah blah
April 2nd, 2008 at 5:55 pm
yeah right you know me better than I know myself is it?
As for the CL run of 05 -
Real Away 0-1 - we played excellent attacking football, should have won 2-0 in a rather open encounter.
Real Home - admittedly cagey performance, no doubt.
Juve Home and Away - thumped them and outplayed them.
Villareal Home - good attacking game.
Away - Agree we played crap
Final - played good attacking stuff and lost out to a barca side who were just a bit too good and possibly beign a man down.
So yes we played 4-5-1, but not defensively. We had a lot of width that season, due to an excellent partnership between Hleb and Eboue. And Eboue was having a storming second half to the season (gone downhill ever since), so we were a pretty attacking side..
April 2nd, 2008 at 5:55 pm
Hey Danny, I have to disagree again. First of all, nobody said that “12 years of failure” was down to luck and not to tactics. We know there have been tactical errors in the past. We’re talking about tonight. Though they got the result they wanted, at no point did I feel Wenger had been outmaneuvered or that Liverpool were putting their stamp on the match. Despite their ability to absorb pressure well, we still created some fine chances. We just couldn’t finish. Unless Benitez paid him off, there’s no reason you can’t chalk up Bendtner’s goal-line clearance to plain old bad luck. Credit to Liverpool for getting the result, but don’t argue that it was a completely deserved one.
April 2nd, 2008 at 5:57 pm
@sachin yeah the ref did seem a bit too pally with some of the liverpool players even before the game in the tunnel
seemed like the players were less keen on passing to cesc that usual, wonder if that has something to do with his average to poor form of late?
April 2nd, 2008 at 5:59 pm
@86 jestanley couldnt have put it better myself
April 2nd, 2008 at 6:01 pm
@jestanley: Well I’m, saying that our inability to create chances and finish was predictable. Like it or lump it, that was Liverpool’s game plan. How many saves did Reina have to make? For me, Liverpool deserved to draw but couldn’t complain if they lost either. But 2-1 Arsenal would not have been a bad result for them.
April 2nd, 2008 at 6:06 pm
is RvP really injured????
April 2nd, 2008 at 6:06 pm
He is was taken off as a precaution, but Wenger feels he will be short for Saturday.
April 2nd, 2008 at 6:12 pm
Hope he makes it, we’re looking seriously short in the striking department. Though hleb did seem to play some of his better stuff when central…
April 2nd, 2008 at 6:18 pm
“short for Saturday”……Wenger-speak for crocked. LOL
With RvP you have to laugh or you’d cry. If it is precautionary great, if not, Wenger is going to be making some pretty crucial decisions come the summer re attacking options. With Robin and Rosicky perpetually out or coming back after injury they’re a liability. They give us an illusion of depth which doesn’t happen. They’re both talented, but if we keep them we need to bolster our depth with guys who are as good as they are. It all leaves me a bit nervous given Wenger’s preference for compact squads.
April 2nd, 2008 at 6:19 pm
the team has grown remarkably well, and they are getting saturated with a heavy dose of experience. they will become stronger not weaker from this.
however, i hope wenger learns from this and makes the squad larger next season.
we need solid backup on the wings. eboue is just plain down, outright pathetic. he is not tired at all, has had almost 2weeks rest yet is just an idiot on the pitch.
hleb showed on one occasion just what he can actually do. the talent is there, but the gut, the winning mentality isnt.
we seriously cant go into next season on hleb, rosicky, eboue…..the wings is the KEY to wenger’s system. he needs to stock on them like he stocks up on RBs.
April 2nd, 2008 at 6:26 pm
i dont think we need to buy strikers………we need “wingers”…….if we get TWO wingers/AMs PLUS vela, then even RvP is injured one of the wingers or Vela or Hleb or Rosicky can go up and partner Ade/Bendtner.
i hope wenger acts. but that is for the summer anyway.
April 2nd, 2008 at 6:34 pm
Yeah I purposefully referred to attacking options not strikers…..with Wenger the line between a winger and a striker can be blurred. They’re often interchangable. Given RvP, Rosicky and Eduardo are the key variables fitness-wise we need cover for them - so versatile attacking players is the go - be they strikers or wingers.