Wenger’s Approach Turns ‘Defensive’ As Arsenal Season Winds Down
May 15, 2009
While his Arsenal teams are known and praised for their attacking, offensive flair and attractive passing game, manager Arsene Wenger’s approach turned a bit “defensive” yesterday when addressing the differences between his side and the Premiership champions and when meeting with supporters gathered for an annual shareholders meeting to voice their comments and concerns with club management.
Arsenal travel to Old Trafford tomorrow to take on Manchester United in their second-to-last Premiership match this season. And while the Gunners’ place in the final league table has already been determined (at fourth), the North London side does have one thing to play for, as a road win would spoil United’s party of clinching the league title in front of home supporters.
With his team going into the contest having suffered heavy defeats in their last two outings, Arsene Wenger believes the Gunners “have a point to prove” when facing the team that ousted them from the Champions League a week ago.
But they’ll need to earn more than “a point” from the match to keep Manchester United from clinching the title tomorrow, as all the home side needs is a draw at Old Trafford to retain the Premiership crown.
With the disappointment still lingering among the club and its supporters after being denied a chance to play in the Champions League final, Wenger views Saturday’s clash “as more a matter of pride than a desire to poop the title party.
“We have a point to prove, definitely,” said the manager at Thursday’s press conference. “It looks like it will be Man United who win the league but we can still delay it. We want to play for our pride and be respected for who we are, that is people who love the game they play.”
“We promised ourselves on the first of January we would give everything in every game until the end of the season,” he continued. “This is where we can show we are capable to do that.”
Wenger also believes his side are closer to United than the 18-point gap currently seen between the two teams in the league table, citing defense as the difference for the side from Manchester.
“What people forget is that we were very far behind and we dropped too many points. Man United are world champions, European champions and will be champions of England,” claimed the manager. “Everybody has to cope with that, not accept it and come back next year and beat them.
“We have a very promising team who can deliver very soon,” added Wenger. “If you look at the statistics of the two teams, for example, we have scored a similar amount of goals. In the passing quality in the final third and in the opposition half, we are as good as Man United. We have conceded more goals and that’s where the difference lies.
“We have conceded 36, they have conceded 24; we have scored 64 and they have scored 67. Offensively, I do not believe there is a difference. Defensively, there was a difference.”
Speaking of the Arsenal defense, first-choice players Manuel Almunia, William Gallas and Gael Clichy are all unavailable for tomorrow’s match at Old Trafford. Defenders Gallas and Clichy are out for the season, while keeper Almunia does have a chance to return in the final league match versus Stoke City, according to Wenger.
The Gunners’ attack will see the return of Andrey Arshavin, who missed the Chelsea match with the flu and is now fully fit. This gives the Russian his first opportunity to face Manchester United in an Arsenal shirt, as he was Cup-tied for the Champions League this season and thus missed both semifinal round matches against the Red Devils.
Arshavin has been impressive in his first half-season at the Emirates after arriving in January for what has been reported as the club’s record transfer signing. Many Arsenal supporters are hoping the club splashes more cash this summer to bring in additional players to help improve the club that has gone four seasons without a trophy.
Wenger’s preferred youth policy and frugality in regard to transfers while managing the club were among the concerns voiced by supporters frustrated with the lack of silverware in recent years, who attended a shareholders meeting at which Wenger spoke on Thursday evening.
Addressing the issue, the manager criticized the negativity among supporters but did admit that his team must deliver in the coming campaigns. “It is easy to sit in the stands and say that they are not up for the fight,” he said. “But what they have done in this season in a negative environment shows what they can do.”
“If they don’t deliver in one or two years, then you can say that it was not the right thing to do. But at the moment this club needs the support of the people who love it,” claimed Wenger. “We want to run the club by respecting our financial values, respecting the game we want to play and developing the players that we have had for five years at this club.
“If we do not get there then I will stand up and be responsible,” added the manager. “But no one has done what this team has done at the average age they are now.”
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May 15th, 2009 at 2:53 pm
I’d like to ask Wenger a respectful ?in reference to “geriatric” Silvestre and it is this: how do refuse 2 yr deals to senior citizens Bergkamp, Pires and Gilberto and yet you give 31yo Silvestre a 2 year deal and loan out Senderos who now looks like Stam when compared to Silvestre. 750K does not look like such a bargain now.
Should he stay or go? Based on what we’ve seen from our ‘star’ CF I could give a rat’s ass if a he stays. Wenger seems to agree by saying he has no objection to selling players to the big 3. His replacement has to offer something we don’t quite have in the CF position (Bendtner comes the closest) and that’s a ‘power’ striker similar to the power forward in basketball and hockey. Drogba epitomizes this type of player but we would do without the drama queen persona.
May 15th, 2009 at 3:02 pm
Some website/paper headlines are puzzled as to why Rafa hasn’t conceded the title to Man Utd? Huh. Which manager would say that his side won’t win the title unless they didn’t still have a mathematical chance? If the positions were reversed, I can guarantee that no headline would ever say that Ferguson isn’t conceding the title. In fact, they would have said that Man Utd still had an outside chance.
yes, it is hard to imagine Man Utd losing two games in a row now but why on earth should the rival manager be asked to concede? If it is that imporant to concede, then maybe at the start of next season, 19 managers should concede that Man Utd will win their 4th straight title. Would that mean that Man Utd will not be asked to play their league fixtures? No. They would still have to go out on the field and beat teams, with or without ref assistance albeit in the form of penalties or 6 minutes injury time.
Man Utd will probably want to get things wrapped up this weekend so they can rest their players for the final game of the season as to prepare for the CL final. I would imagine Barca aiming to finally get that title officially bagged as well after giving up that late goal last weekend. Although Barca have the advantage of seeing Madrid play first away to Villarreal and things might be decided even before Barca take to the pitch.
May 15th, 2009 at 3:06 pm
Since Robert Pires is probably my “favorite” Arsenal player over the years, I’d agree with the issue raised above by “ctpa” in regard to over-30 players … what is so different now that we couldn’t at least consider offering two-year contracts for such established team veterans as Pires and Gilberto in recent years?
May 15th, 2009 at 3:33 pm
Its a foregone conclusion, innit?
United aren’t losing the last 2 matches & certainly not against Arsenal and Hull.
So Rafa can believe… there is a chance, but everybody knows.
May 15th, 2009 at 3:36 pm
I think most people agree on Pires… though there were not many who complained much when he was gone.
Gilberto was the whipping boy … time and time again… never fully appreciated for what he brought to the team, or if he was, it was quickly forgotten.
Its a crazy policy, when dealing with certain players. It can’t / shouldn’t be across the board… because life doesn’t work with the broad brush.
May 15th, 2009 at 4:01 pm
Ha. Even this Arsenal ‘defense’ is full of holes.
My favorite Michael saved for last…
“But no one has done what this team has done at the average age they are now.”
Perhaps because no one has ever intentionally constructed a team terminally designed to be full of potential, while never actually accomplishing anything. Typical of the smoke he’s been blowing all season. Self-justifying BS.
May 15th, 2009 at 4:41 pm
I do feel as if the questions were asked a little disrespectfully. I too have questions for the Prof, but respect where respect is due.
After all is said and done, I don’t think he’s lost the plot. He misjudged slightly, but overall I think he will structure cleverly over the summer, remembering we have Eduardo and Tom back and maybe fill in the defensive holes. If he got 1 striker and 1 defender, I think I’d be happy.
May 15th, 2009 at 5:31 pm
Wenger railed at a shareholder’s assertion that 31-year-old defender Mickael Silvestre was a “geriatric”, while admitting that he would be willing to sell striker Emmanuel Adebayor – another who came in for criticism – to London rivals Chelsea.
http://www.teamtalk.com/football/story/0,16368,1766_5324399,00.html
May 15th, 2009 at 6:34 pm
Stephen, Wenger has lost the plot in many ways.
1) How can anyone in their right mind justify not bringing in a DM replacement after losing your top 3 starters in Diarra, Flamini and Gilberto. Remember, Song was not seen as a DM by Arsene.
2) How can anyone justify not starting 2 of their best players, Song and Arshavin, in an FA Cup semi-final, especially when Arshavin was CL cup tied. His justification was that he wanted to start the same team as he would have played in the CL semis. Duh, Song and another were CL starters.
3) How can you justify terrible team formations and continually playing “YOUNG, INEXPERIENCED” players out of position in critical games.
4) How can you justify having 3 of our brightest future stars, Ramsey, Wilshire and Vela, sitting on the bench and getting no match experience, even at the Reserve level.
5) How can you justify having players who can’t cross the ball, players who are one footed, players who don’t know the meaning of switching plays, GK’s who punt the ball down field so we continually lose possession, players who have pass when passing lanes are closed down.
Even if we get new, experienced, world class players, we still need to fix Coaching 101. Seems liked we moved to Coaching 301 without bothering with the basics.
I don’t mean to sound like gloom and doom, but we have some very intrinsic problems which need to be addressed even if we get new players. Great ball control and triangular passing is great, but we need to get back to the basics also. That’s why we have so many incomplete players.
May 15th, 2009 at 6:36 pm
Let’s fix this edit thing, I sound like a moron sometimes without it.
May 15th, 2009 at 7:06 pm
completely missing the point of the comment you are responding to. again.
May 15th, 2009 at 8:11 pm
Jeez, man. Reads right to me.
May 15th, 2009 at 10:23 pm
Pretty funny recent “episode” of “Special 1 TV” from Setanta. The delusional AW part starts about 3 minutes in.
http://footballblips.dailyradar.com/video/special_1_tv_ep12_wormholes_a_voyeur_in_denial/
May 15th, 2009 at 10:58 pm
now that was good
May 16th, 2009 at 12:22 am
That’s awesome.
AW: I still think we can make the Champions League final.
S1: In a parallel universe, maybe.
May 16th, 2009 at 12:30 am
Sorry that I haven’t had time to come onto the site. Fourteen hour days makes it tough. A lot has happened over the past month; too much to discuss.
I hope Wenger’s not blowing smoke recognizing the need for old heads in the team. They serve as mentors. That’s very significant for a young player. Wenger can’t do everything. I like to use the Vieira example by referring to him as a hybrid. Sure, he was a good player when he came to Arsenal. But he developed into a phenom unlike anything I’ve ever seen on a football field. Teams all over the world are still looking for someone who can do what Vieira did. Is it because of Wenger? Partly but, in my opinion, the influence of Keown, Adams, and Petit was more significant. Without their influence, does he become world class? Who knows. Does Henry without the influence of Bergkamp, Kanu, and even Adams? Once again, who knows.
I’ve griped about it the past two summers. The reality is we don’t have any big brothers in the team; players who are in their prime and can show the younger players how to win something. It’s so much harder for these kids to figure it out on thier own.
Wenger will have to make some tough choices concerning a few players next season. Gallas will still be broke at the start of next season so he’ll still be here. Toure has pledged his future to Arsenal so we’ll see how that works out. van Persie has to decide if he believes he can become a superstar at Arsenal. Wenger’s got to decide what he’s going to do with Eduardo and Bendtner. We need a DM badly. Song and Denilson have both produced good and poor performances at DM but neither are really DM players. There’s a real need there. I’m happy with Almunia. He’s been very solid and you won’t find a keeper who’s significantly better. If you do, he’ll cost more than Arshavin did. Almunia’s not bad enough to pay that kind of money for a keeper.
All of our Wenger-era titles have come in even numbered years; ’98, ’02, ’04. I believe it’s because players had an actual off-season without international tournaments (World Cup/Euro Cup) and, essentially, the entire sqaud were available for the entire pre-season and started the season fit. Even last year (2008) we were close to winning a title after a proper pre-season. I’m optimistic that a pre-season this year will provide us with the same opportunity.
Long week, gotta go to bed, about to pass out. I’ll talk some more trash next time.
May 16th, 2009 at 1:02 am
good. again.
May 16th, 2009 at 1:54 am
Thanks Vibe
May 16th, 2009 at 1:57 am
Another nice read – http://www.onlinegooner.com/exclusive/index.php?id=1155
“When you fall in love with another person, part of what you fall in love with is the picture you create in your own mind. Very often you simply impose your own idealised vision of the other person, regardless of whether they in fact have those qualities. And it can take years before you finally admit that the picture is inaccurate and that you have to compromise and get on with them as they are. This is the transition from romance to a mature relationship.”
May 16th, 2009 at 2:05 am
Hilarious.
May 16th, 2009 at 3:53 am
Interestingly earlier today I was thinking about Wenger’s comment to Ferguson all those years ago that “Everyone thinks they have the prettiest wife at home.” In a way, some aspects of this article do form a response to those words because Wenger while may find beauty in this team, he is frustrated that others don’t. But then again, isn’t beauty in the eye of the beholder?
Ofcourse, the counter response to that came on Thursday’s meeting as well as it seemed that some supporters need to get their vision sorted out because they aren’t seeing clearly.
There was a good response Wenger gave back in 2002 regarding the strength in his team: “I can go home at night knowing this team will give every last drop of their blood for me and Arsenal “.
Does he feel the same about the team now? From the meeting on Thursday night, he questioned supporters who thought that players didn’t give it their all.
May 16th, 2009 at 7:57 am
We need another good bashing today from United. Anybody up for it?
May 16th, 2009 at 9:47 am
Official now. Rafa’s Liverpool won’t win. Atleast, not in this universe. Not sure if Rafa believes in worm holes and all.
Also, does it appear that Ade is going? He wasn’t on the bench, was he? Was he in the stands?
May 16th, 2009 at 9:54 am
Didn’t know that Arshavin read Arsenal America
“We must buy in the summer,” he told the Daily Mail. “Not more potential, but players who are ready to do it now, players like me.
“We need two or three. If Arsenal want to win they have to do it – we are tired of waiting.
“At the moment young players come to Arsenal because they see it as a very big team, but if we carry on like this without winning trophies, young players will not want to come.”
May 16th, 2009 at 10:23 am
I don’t know if it is coming from him though. But if it is, great. I am pretty sure Wenger will tell him to low down a bit and starts mumbling this and that.
May 16th, 2009 at 10:23 am
Well that did not happen. Good.
May 16th, 2009 at 10:33 am
Expect Arshavin to be dropped for the Stoke game for questioning Arsene’s policy.
May 16th, 2009 at 10:35 am
I thought we played with great spirit, determination, quality, hunger and drive today. To draw with the champions of Europe and the champions of England at their very home with such a young team is a tremendous achievement. Remember, we were missing Almunia, Gallas, Clichy, Rosicky, Eduardo and Adebayor.
This game shows that we are not too far off from ManU. Don’t let the 18-point gap fool you. This team is young and will grow next year. If not, the year after that, if not, the year after …
May 16th, 2009 at 10:39 am
Sachin, if you read the conversation between Stag and me in an earlier article, you would know by now that Stag doesn’t believe that the referees are biased towards ManU.
Today, we got 5 yellow cards and ManU got how many? Do you remember any malicious tackle? With the score at 0-0, there was only 3 mins of added time. Any guesses what it would have been if ManU were trailing? No points for getting that right.
May 16th, 2009 at 10:50 am
I think two of those yellow cards were whatever bizarre set of incidents happened with Evra at the start of the second half. Nasri pointed out that was his first such tackle. And then Tevez does something similar and gets away with it. I was surprized they actually gave three minutes. I thought they might have rushed to finish it sooner.
May 16th, 2009 at 11:46 am
The games shows nothing Nipuna, Manure were playing defensively because they wanted to win the title at home. How soon we forget the CL where they took us apart home and away.
May 16th, 2009 at 12:01 pm
I chose not watch the game and instead went to a hockey game. So it seems I missed a draw w/ “great spirit, determination quality, hunger and drive today.” I expected us to get spanked by the ‘men’ of Man U and to our credit that was not allowed to happen. Good for Arsenal. We are still going to finish this season “limping and wimping”.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/football_focus/8053447.stm
Give it a rest Adebayor. If you work hard, score and do not let the name Milan come out of your mouth, then the fans will again be behind and sing your name.
Adebayor was ‘rested’ today w/ a groin injury. That should mean Adebayor won’t play again this season.
Arshavin just gets off the ‘boat’ in January and he already has Arsenal figured out. Wenger can not tell him to just worry about his game because his game has been great.
Lame Sp**s beat an even lamer Man City w/ the help of Mark Halsey.
May 16th, 2009 at 12:19 pm
http://www.arsenal.com/news/news-archive/-we-played-with-a-lot-of-heart-and-desire-
Wenger’s comments not far off from mine.
May 16th, 2009 at 12:31 pm
Atleast he didn’t dodge the Evra question:
On a flurry of fouls committed against Patrice Evra…
“I believe that no matter in victory or defeat you should show respect to your opponents. The best answer is always to play good football and to give the answer on the pitch. Of course players are sensitive to certain remarks. I felt, though, that we got some cheap yellow cards today.”
So in a way, Cesc, Van Persie and Nasri wanted to show Evra a thing or two but unfortunately it wasn’t via a good footballing channel. But two of them got booked and when Tevez responded in a similar manner, he didn’t.
After Van Persie went in late on Evra, it looked like things might boil over. Brought back memories of days when Arsenal were title contenders and tempers did flair up. Today, it seemed out of place.
May 16th, 2009 at 12:47 pm
yes, but not mumbling this n that, segue into the parallel universe concept; where next season we better utilize OUR worm holes…..
May 16th, 2009 at 12:49 pm
CK, I believe nip is being really, really, really sarky. Note the excessive Wenger-speak.
May 16th, 2009 at 12:49 pm
Yes.
It’s a conspiracy.
ManU aren’t better than Arsenal, or any other teams… its all down to
biased refereeing.
Or.
Perhaps they are just far superior to Arsenal in the last few years.
Yeah. That’s what it is.
May 16th, 2009 at 12:56 pm
agree……
but they did start Ronaldo, Tevez, and Rooney: none of these players hold anything back (Rooney and Tevez are merciless warriors);
Song had an excellent match at CB and this is likely where we will see him anchored next season.
May 16th, 2009 at 1:05 pm
Fergie’s comment after the title party – we are already targeting title #19.
Arsene’s comments – we will try next year, if not the year after, if not …
May 16th, 2009 at 1:12 pm
No, I was being serious, really.
May 16th, 2009 at 2:43 pm
LOL.
Before him the score was Liverpool 18 – Man U 7….
Now the guy has equalized the score ….. and he is still hungry to take the lead.
Make no mistake the guy is a fucking champion.
May 16th, 2009 at 3:00 pm
Will be interesting to see how many experienced players Man Utd bring in the summer even if Tevez and Ronaldo don’t leave. 2 to 3?
May 16th, 2009 at 4:12 pm
Arsenal step up in a big game finally! Shame it was only a big game for the opposition
I could see Wenger remonstrating with the fourth official over the time alloted for injuries and right from that you could tell he was desperate to nick the game at the death and say” see, we beat them home and away. When has a team with an average age of 22.22111100 beat the world champions and european champions twice in a season?”
May 16th, 2009 at 6:00 pm
Yup, they will bring in another winger, a CM and a striker.
A striker to replace Tevez, a CM because they dont trust Hargreaves will be fully fit, and a winger because it seems Ferguson is tiring of Nani.
While we on the other hand have a whack-assed team and are talking about 1 or 2 at the most.
May 16th, 2009 at 6:02 pm
Funny how Darren Fletcher who is considered fifth choice (when everybody is fit) plays BETTER than anybody we have in CM.
Fletcher is exactly like Flamini (just bigger) ….and that shows you how far apart our teams are.
Their Flamini is fifth choice while we dont even have a Flamini.
May 16th, 2009 at 9:31 pm
I’ll leave it at that
May 16th, 2009 at 10:18 pm
While Arsenal need to strengthen to keep up with the other 3 English teams, I think this summer might also see some changes which would challenge Barcelona and the English clubs in the CL. Madrid have their galatico chasing president back so with a new coach, there will be some rebuilding there. Bayern have Louis Van Gaal so some new faces might arrive and 1-2 might leave. Both the Milan clubs will ring in changes as well.
As far as the English clubs are concerned, it is hard to believe Man Utd will not get anyone. Since other clubs will be spending, Rafa won’t be left behind and try to bring in 3-4 players to try to get it right. Not sure what will happen at Chelsea. New coach and how many new players?
Arsenal can’t afford to be left behind this time around, not only against the other 3 domestically but also on the European stage. Felt last summer was crucial for Arsenal but this summer feels even more crucial.
May 17th, 2009 at 12:05 am
Not to mention that Tottenham and City also have a decent player base and money to spend. If spent wisely they will definitely improve and could threaten Arsenal’s string of top 4 finishes in the EPL.
May 17th, 2009 at 12:52 am
“Arsenal can’t afford to be left behind this time around…”
No, we can’t. But how many people around here, when you really look at it objectively (i.e. taking into account Wenger’s comments the past few weeks, his actions over the past few seasons, etc.) REALLY, honestly and truly believe we will make the necessary personnel changes in the summer? I for one do not think we will even try, let alone succeed, at bringing in experienced, quality players.
May 17th, 2009 at 12:57 am
I just watched the BBC interview with Adebayor and thought he was not only being truthful, but what he said was for most part true.
Regardless of how much I rant and rave about Arsenal not winning, I would never, and have never, booed anyone playing for a club I supported. We are called supporters, and therefore we need to support the players and encourage them on the pitch.
As much as I whinge about Arsene, and would ask him tough questions if given the chance, I would never disrespect the man nor would I boo him.
If you failure to support your vocally and otherwise during games how do you expect them to be motivated and give of their best. Even though some of them may be multi-million cry babies, they are representing the club of your choice, and believe it or not, they are also human beings too.
The question here is, How would you feel if every time you did a task at the office your co-workers criticized you? Under that situation, how long could you remain happy and motivated? Could you perform your job effectively under those circumstances?
I know for certain I could not work under those circumstances.
Think about it guys.
May 17th, 2009 at 1:15 am
The top three leagues were all decided yesterday – ManU, Barca and Inter. The latter two didn’t even play.
May 17th, 2009 at 2:24 am
I saw that interview and was thinking how different my feelings about this team’s persona is compared to the older teams. There was a time when a lot of the Arsenal players made me feel happy and even if some of them missed a chance, I would not be that upset. I saw the Villarreal-Madrid game and was delighted when Pires scored a beautifully headed goal. Heck, I still smile everytime I see him play. Same with Henry at Barca. I still have fond feelings about a lot of those older players going back to GG’s team. I am certain I am not the only one who still feels fondly of these older players. While they were very good and they gave it all their all but they also also missed chances and had bad games but overall I wasn’t too upset at them.
But with the current team, there are only a few that I genuinely like. And not all of them are bad players but only few seem to possess that persona like under the old team. I do expect that I can’t like every Arsenal player who plays for the team but as long as they do the job, then I won’t complain. And like you, I would never boo an Arsenal player but if I am not happy with an Arsenal player, I might not fully appreciate what they are doing either. Sure I can see Ade’s viewpoint from this interview but he did have bad games last season. I am certain no fan booed him them as he was scoring plenty of goals. But he was missing plenty as well. I can understand if the players are unhappy with the fans behavior but let’s say if every Arsenal game was played behind closed doors, would these same players do better, the same or worse? Recently, it is amazing that Wenger’s comments and Ade’s words have turned the tide towards fans. Are fans the sole reason for this season’s failure? No. On the other hand, it is a two way street. While fans have to do their part, the players also have to give it their all. If they play well, the fans won’t complain. Now, I am not sure how true those headlines were last summer which quoted Ade as saying that if he is paid like Henry, he will play like Henry. So this interview is like him saying if the fans give him love, then he will play better. Vieira and Henry also had transfer rumours about them and Vieira was pretty close to have signed for Madrid. Yet, were these guys booed?
There is another factor which has unfairly shed a negative light on some players. There were plenty of situations this past season where players have played out of position or in different formations not suited to their style and as a result, they have made mistakes and looked lost. Who is to be blamed there? The player or the manager? I think this Thursday’s meeting was the first real criticism that Wenger faced in person otherwise, it was some of the players who got the brunt of those overall frustrations with the team.
May 17th, 2009 at 2:46 am
Yup, unfortunately I agree with you.
We will sell Adebayor and get a random 22 year old striker from France after 3 or 4 weeks of chasing. Then we will get one silvestre type player at defense to replace Gallas. And that will be it.
May 17th, 2009 at 2:59 am
I completely disagree with this.
Do not join the stupid “blame it on the fans” group.
Arsenal fans are by FAR the most tolerant and patient fans you will see in Europe. I know, I have been to a lot of games across the continent.
Arsenal fans pay the HIGHEST TICKET PRICES in the whole of England. England has by far the highest tickets in Europe and Europe has the highest tickets in the world!
Therefore Arsenal fans pay the highest ticket prices in the world!
Arsenal fans have been patient for FOUR seasons without much complaint.
Go pull that crap at Man U and Chelsea, they will demand the board or the managers head in 3 month!
Good luck trying that at a top European club like Barca or Madrid. Pull crap on them for THREE games…..they will fucking burn you.
Believe it or not, if Ferguson messes up for 4 or 5 months next season, the fans will start GRUMBLING straight away and start talking of “past it”, “he should retire”.
Arsenal fans are by FAR the most patient fans in world sports that I have ever come across. I am very impressed there was no open mutiny at one of the home games this season.
May 17th, 2009 at 3:04 am
PS: A fan has the RIGHT to boo …. when he sees obvious crap.
NO fan in the world will boo a hardworking player working his socks off even if he is of low quality and misses chances! That is fact.
When the player is a lazy bumfuck, he is overpaid and he is of low quality ….. like a LOT of our players, why on earth should they not be booed!
Do you realize the fans PART with their hard earned money????
—————————————————————————-
As for Adebayor, he is a dumbfuck, retard of a player. His interviews should not be listened to or discussed. The clown cant even speak french right let alone English.
May 17th, 2009 at 3:10 am
I agree. In ALL the past teams, there was always a strong connection with the players. Even when they lost or missed loads of chances, they were OUR losers.
This set are just a bunch of poor quality, overpaid mercenaries.
The most ironic part of all this is that even though Wenger is wasting OUR time with them, they have NO loyalty whatsoever. Anybody who thinks these players other than Fabregas and Toure care one bit is sniffing glue.
Am still waiting for Andez to break it down for me …
May 17th, 2009 at 4:58 am
There is a joke doing the rounds on the internet -
Now that Martin Laursen has announced his retirement due to injuries, it is highly likely that Arsene will sign him.
I would have laughed if there wasn’t a bit of truth in it.
May 17th, 2009 at 5:04 am
CK, I listened to Adebayor too, and came away thinking he sounds like a guy resigned to leaving. I’m not arguing the rights nor wrongs of his worldview, but all those folk who don’t like what he contributes will likely get what they hope for.
Sachin, well scripted, it echo’s many of my own thoughts. Arsene can preach all he likes, the truth is you can’t force supporters to support. It’s voluntary, it’s a love thing, if the team doesn’t engender it – look at the recipe. Grow up. We’re talking outrageously lavished young men (& managers) playing sport. It’s not alturistic, or noble, it’s sport, should be fun, a diversion from the more mundane, sad and difficult things in life. Without supporters the club ceases to exist.
Fred, I agree, if Arsenal fans have done anything wrong, they’re been TOO tolerant, too patient. Perhaps stronger murmurings earlier were needed.
May 17th, 2009 at 5:04 am
I don’t think Arsene can blame the fans. Here is kind of why
-
“I feel that M. Wenger’s comments at the shareholders meeting were very ill-advised. He is very critical of the supporters attitude at the Emirates, but the home demographic has changed dramatically due to the ‘fleece monster’ stadium which HE was largely influential in creating, meaning only the affluent can afford to go.”
Arsenal moved to a big stadium to make more money. Obviously, it is not possible to have 60,000+ blindly loyal supporters. A large section would be new fans who cannot be expected to have the same sentiment as say the people who were supporting earlier at Highbury. We can debate if it is right or wrong, but that it not the point. Like it or not, this is inevitable and any big club should be ready to handle it.
May 17th, 2009 at 5:07 am
The quote is from http://www.football365.com/mailbox/story/0,17033,8744_5325348,00.html.
I put the link in and it vanished in the earlier posting.
May 17th, 2009 at 5:09 am
Arsene keeps saying that this team does not get enough credit.
I think the fans don’t get enough credit for being patient during four long trophy-less years.
May 17th, 2009 at 5:10 am
Arsene said that the two league games against ManU showed that we are not too far away from them.
Arseblog as the perfect reply for this – “the North London derbies are generally tight, close matches, that doesn’t mean Sp*rs are anywhere near as good as us, does it?”
As Arsene himself has said it before – the league table does not lie.
May 17th, 2009 at 8:47 am
Kiwi, I agree for most part with what you and most others are saying in general regarding fan support and criticism. I also agree with Fred’s comment “A fan has the right to boo”. Yes, fans have a right to boo, but, but, fans also need to realize that by booing their own team it downgrades us and uplifts the opposition.
Fans must also then realize that this will make teams eager to play on us turf as they will have no cause for fear and will literally remove the “home field” advantage. Do we really want to do that, especially in view of our young, emotionally fragile team?
Another thing to consider, is that most of these players, if not all, are doing their best although the results may not indicate it. Asking a group of young players with very little seasoning to play out of natural positions in a complex “total football” scheme is almost like trying to get milk from a bull, impossible. Asking them to go to plan B, when the manager has not defined one is also somewhat impossible.
There is only one goal common to all Arsenal fans and that is to see our team WIN. Having the right to boo is one thing, but if by exercising that right it makes winning more difficult how does that help any of us. In light of this, I contend that any fan who boos their own player is not a REAL FAN.
It just doesn’t make one iota of sense to boo your own team. Fans need to vent their frustrations by booing the opposition unmercifully and making life difficult for any non “Arsenalite” who steps into our hallowed ground.
Plus, if we support our team in this manner, it’s just removes another one of Arsene’s petty excuses for failure.
We can protest by leaving empty seats at the stadium, not buying merchandise, unsubscribing from Arsenal subscriptions, protesting outside the stadium, scathe the Board in blogs, complain thru the AST and flood Arsenal.com with nasty letters and Emails.
Just my take.
May 17th, 2009 at 9:10 am
when Djourou and Clichy had given up penalty kicks – did we hearing booing ?
I think we need to give the fans more credit for understanding the game than what psychology Wenger is trying to spin. Fans understand when key players are missing from a match.
Football is entertainment and as Fred pointed out – supporters have a right to express our emotions.
IMO, booing is the end result reaching the tipping point for no effort.
If we all were asked to vote on the (most) disappointing Arsenal personnel THIS SEASON, who would you vote for? (not trying to focus on the negative)
For me its our Manager.
May 17th, 2009 at 10:29 am
I think what Arsene needs to keep in mind is that booing is expressed frustration that still brings the club revenue. The next natural expression(as you’ve said) is not showing up to the matches, not buying the gear, not spending money on ATVO, etc. In that way, booing is a warning sign the Manger and and the Board would be wise to heed.
Arsene’s petty excuses are just that. Increasingly, they are seen as such. I wouldn’t worry about adding to his repertoire. It’s embarrasses him more than it does the supporters, at this point.
Yeah, booing is ugly. But I will have to disagree with you, as I have with Andez, about this notion of booing making one a BAD FAN.
Like the players, the supporters are human, emotional creatures. And I daresay most of us are more passionate about our Clubs than the players are. After all, a REAL FAN will only ever have ONE team. But the players will go anywhere they’re paid too.
And, of course, unlike the players, the fans aren’t being paid thousands upon thousands of pounds to visit the cold, rainy Emirates on match days.
They accept the checks every week, win or lose.
They accept the glory and being treated more special than they probably deserve (we tend to rather spoil our entertainers, no?).
So they, like the Manager, need to accept the criticism and disappointment when they do not do well. And how that is often expressed, in person, is booing. It’s all part of the same continuum, so I don’t see how ANY of it can be construed as bad. It’s a natural response to what’s going on. It’s a challenge that comes with the job. And, as other have said on here, they’ve been pretty damn patient in the N5.
In terms of the psychology of our young, fragile team, I feel the same way I did around the time of Eboue(booey)-gate. It’s on the Manger. He created the situation. More than anything else, I think the booing should resonate in the ears of Wenger the loudest. He needs to accept it as a Performance Review. And he needs to do better.
(Man, I just know I’m going to regret not being able to edit this.)
May 17th, 2009 at 10:32 am
“A large section would be new fans who cannot be expected to have the same sentiment as say the people who were supporting earlier at Highbury.”
Right. And let’s be honest about that, as well. It’s not as if the Library was the most fearsome place to visit. If anything, I’d actually give the in-person supporters a little more stick for not be loud when things are going well.
May 17th, 2009 at 11:14 am
Since Fergie is still getting praises and talking of future glory, I couldn’t help think about how things would have been different if Arsenal had gotten 3 titles they lost. In 1999, they lost the title by a single point and threw away the title in 2003 and last season. And Man Utd benefited in all those three cases. Had Arsenal not slipped up in those cases, Wenger’s total would have been 6 and Fergie would have 8 titles. In that case, Wenger’s ratio would have been much better given he has had a decade less at Arsenal than Fergie has had at Man Utd. But now, the gap is too much. In 23 years, Fergie has 11 English titles while Wenger has 3 titles in 13 years (minus a few months). Although Chelsea took the title in 2005, it was Man Utd that put up the wrench in Arsenal’s path that season, so that could also be counted as another title gone for Arsenal.
The funny thing I never cared to think of titles in all those lost years because Arsenal were playing great football. It felt like if they continued playing in that manner, the title would surely arrive and be a bonus. And if didn’t arrive, then there would always be next year. Now, somehow the lack of titles is mixed with other issues such as poor play of the team, player’s attitude and now tied with fan’s behaviour. All things can’t be fixed at once but I think if the team’s issues are fixed first and the team starts playing good football regularly, it would certainly address other aspects. Also, it wasn’t a bad thing to talk about Arsenal & winning titles until a few years ago. But now trophies and titles have become a bad word that only “spoiled” fans would want.
May 17th, 2009 at 11:20 am
That’s exactly my point Spot On, if Wenger is the culprit, then we should boo the Manager and not the players.
I don’t care what anyone says to justify the booing of players, it is counterproductive to the team performance. If we the fans are so intelligent, then let’s go to the real source of our frustrations, Arsene Wenger.
Let’s boo Wenger, hold demonstrations, create adverse publicity until someone reacts. We are just taking it out on the wrong people, the players.
May 17th, 2009 at 12:51 pm
The task just keeps getting tougher and tougher. From 97-02, there was only ManU. From 03-07, there was ManU and Chelsea. Now, there is ManU, Chelsea and Liverpool. None of these teams will lie still, they will all strengthen (the manner in which they do it is not relevant). What will Arsene do?
May 17th, 2009 at 1:04 pm
Arshavin is a difference maker. In his thirteen starts for the club, Arsenal are unbeaten. In the eight matches that he has missed since making his debut, Arsenal have won just two and lost five.
May 17th, 2009 at 1:43 pm
What you are saying is completely wrong.
Yes the manager is the real culprit and the fans should really have a go at him….BUT the fans still have the RIGHT to boo their own players when they are NOT trying enough.
With their millions if they dont have the thick skin to handle it at a “big” club they should fuck off to Hull or Wigan …. where their laziness will …. surprise, surprise …. also be booed!
Name ONE club where their fans dont boo their players when they step out of line?
PS: Funny how the boos Eboue and Bendtner endured didnt “kill” them. It actually improved their performance. Infact Eboue has stopped his theatrics all together! And there you are saying booing is bad!
May 17th, 2009 at 2:04 pm
Fred, you just don’t get it.
If you read my comments carefully, I have said fans have the right to boo. Is it counterproductive to team morale and results? YES.
So, if you want to keep booing your club players, go right on doing it if that is what turns you on.
To say it’s not counterproductive is just plain hogwash. Give me a list of your co-workers and I’ll tell them to criticize you every day and see how you perform and feel.
May 17th, 2009 at 3:57 pm
How ON EARTH is it counterproductive???
Which players did the fans boo EVERY game??? NONE!
The idea that fans boo the players regularly is fictional.
The only players who got significantly booed were Eboue and Bendtner.
And their performance IMPROVED. Enough said!
———————————————————————-
Feeling pressure is part and parcel of being at the TOP of ANY profession … let alone soccer. All the fans of all the major and even minor clubs BOO their lazy bumpkins……yet those clubs are still successful … PROVING that putting your wayward rascals on the straight path (by heckling them) is NOT as counterproductive as you think. Again, go ask Eboue.
May 17th, 2009 at 4:00 pm
PS: Guess how Ferguson “motivates” his players at halftime when they are playing like shit??
He screams at them, throws tea cups and boots, bla, bla.
Am pretty sure that is worse than getting booed. Yet no one has died from it yet.
They earn the money, they are living at the top of their profession. They can either put up or get down to the West Brom level of serenity or mediocrity.
May 17th, 2009 at 6:29 pm
Fascinating the lack of interest in Arsenal v ManU and in commenting on the club in general. Where are all the posters?
The sense of malaise hanging over things is palpable.
I was really surprised at the reaction to Wenger’s angry comments toward shareholders. Mostly silence. Why such apathy given such pointed remarks from Wenger? I think this is based on 2 things. First, most supporters still have a deep respect for the man and don’t want to see him humiliated, and second, the truth seems evident to most people – the problems are still the problems. Everyone is left with the same thought “how long?”.
Last season we were undone at the end – due to a lack of strength in depth, this season we were undone at the start – due to a lack of quality & synergy. I’m guessing few supporters feel particularly optimistic at present. They would like to, but Wenger’s comments seem to solidify his commitment to his current strategy, a strategy that is more suited to Auxerre or Middlesborough than a club aspiring to go head to head with ManU, Real, Barca, AC Milan, & Bayern.
The real source of the malaise is the sense of hopelessness. The sense that this drama will continue to play out to an unhappy conclusion.
May 17th, 2009 at 7:45 pm
You’ve got to respect Ferguson, I make it 23 trophies in 23 seasons – and the CL would make it 24! What a record.
Contrary to what some folk quote, after the initial settling-in period of 3 barren years he has only ever had gaps of 1 season without a trophy. That is amazing.
Whilst he now enjoys a comparative advantage in certain highly significant ways, that is very much a reward for his sustained era of success. The fact that they continually deliver and win means they reap significant financial rewards vis sponsorship, full houses, brand appeal, merchandising and a larger slice of the tv cake.
I can’t help but be impressed with how Ferguson stays grounded – he knows how to succeed and he maintains his motivation.
He follows the Liverpool model of constant replenishment of his squad with players of real quality. Even when they don’t seem to ‘need’ it. He understands that once you achieve success you then have 2 battles – first to do it again and second to maintain the squads motivation. Without in any way diminishing our own success – we have never been able to win consecutive titles. Yet Ferguson knows that players need to feel the ‘threat’ that their place may be in jeopardy if their motivation wanes. Liverpool maintained their dynasty on this very same basis. So to the Rooney, Ronaldo, Teves trio he adds Berbatov! I wouldn’t be surprised to see Berbatov play better next season.
Contrast that to our current squad and the very real sense of comfort that the first team exist within. Is it good for them? What pressure is on them to perform when they know there is no one pushing for their place? The truth is we struggled for much of the year (just like last season) to field 11 top players. Almost every side we put out had a patch or 2 or 3 or 4…… Adebayor enjoys a good season and then thinks he’s indispensable, and he was. Because there was no one of any real quality pushing him. So his snotty attitude perculated – at United he would either perform or be dropped. With Arsene’s startegy we can’t do that. Too many very very average players walk in to our starting side.
May 17th, 2009 at 9:08 pm
I’m firmly in the “problems are still problems” way of thinking.
Unlike most recent dissenters of Wenger’s managerial performance, I’ve been scrutinising and noticing signs of disintegration in him for at least three years. I called for him to go in January 2006 after the defeat to Liverpool at Anfield, which sounds ridiculous now considering how long ago that was, but even then I didn’t like the way he was reacting to criticism, building the squad etc. I was also wary at the nature of the mentality he was cultivating in the squad, especially in the absence of the “Graham” players. We were becoming more gallic, foreign, and flimsy. A self-defeating sense of entitlement was also becoming apparent in and around the team.
Save for a champions league final, and a decent premiership campaign last season, things have panned out almost exactly how I imagined they would if asked back then. Wenger has increasingly got lost in his extremist rhetoric and seems to have lost sight of reality to a large degree. He even appears ‘dated’ compared to other managers in the sense of placing so much importance to media speak, while others like Ferguson just tell it as it is without provoking a squad backlash. For a manager feated for innovation, his approach to the media and other issues are becoming increasingly formulaic and transparent, giving further evidence as to why he’s failed to implement his youth policy with any great conviction or success.
So at the moment it is, as you’ve said, a case of waiting to see how the demise plays out.
May 17th, 2009 at 9:11 pm
The loss of edit function is part of the conspiracy to “dumb” down the dissidents of Wenger. Ruin our credibility
May 17th, 2009 at 9:51 pm
“….in the absence of the “Graham” players…”
Interesting that Ferguson has always maintained a core of anglo-celtic players. From Hughes, Ince & Giggs to Beckham, Scholes, the Neville bro’s & Keane to Rooney, Carrick, Ferdinand, Fletcher, Brown, & O’Shea and yes even still Giggs, Scholes & Neville.
Whilst much is made of the big foreign signings at ManU he has maintained the British spirit as it’s core. I guess you have to answer for yourself whether the gallic attitude is as adequate as a base as the British.
Whilst it’s academic, I still question whether we would have enjoyed any success under Wenger without the English defensive base he inherited. Even Mk II had Campbell, Cole and Keown and a bevy of players who had experienced the original culture of the Mk I side.
It’s too simplistic to isolate and eulogise the British spirit over the French as a silver bullet but for me this is undoubtedly part of the mix that needs consideration when Arsene ponders in the summer ‘at a distance’.
For me the culture that has emerged is less than ideal. I do not believe this side have the same passion and determination as Mk I nor compared to ManU nor Chelsea. Unfortunately Wenger makes things hard for himself, the choice of Henry and then Gallas and now Fabregas as captain just entrenches the flakyness – albeit for differing reasons. True, the team does still aspire to play footballing triangles, but winning requires an intangible quality of attitude and character, a determination that does whatever it takes to get the result even when the fluency and verve is lacking in your play.
I think it was Nip who some time ago said that the gap between winning and coming 2nd is enormous. This is very true. What he was getting at is the attitude and quality of a winning team that imposes its will and play on the opposition. On that score, we really are some way short.
May 17th, 2009 at 11:11 pm
Here you go Kiwi, I’ll break the silence for you with a blinkered Kool Aid heavy post. It didn’t get put up so I thought I’d put it up here and link it for AA to read if they’re interested:
http://live-dont-exist.xanga.com/702154161/arsenal—a-reflection/
May 17th, 2009 at 11:30 pm
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1183670/Arsenal-boss-Wenger-admits-working-Perez-Real-Madrid-interesting.html\
Wenger clashing with board over money… Hmmm…
May 17th, 2009 at 11:30 pm
Love these Arshavin quotes too
“We must buy in the summer. Not more potential, but players who are ready to do it now, players like me. We need two or three. If Arsenal want to win, they have to do it. We are tired of waiting.
“I love Barcelona for the same reasons I love Arsenal. It is as if they do not even think of the result, they just want to play and score and if they lose, OK, then they will go out and do it again and win next time. At Arsenal, all we think about is how to attack, how to score, how to dribble, how to make a pass. We do not think so much about defence. Probably, for results, this is no good: but I like it.”
May 18th, 2009 at 12:02 am
Arsenal have got to have that English presence in the locker room. The British contingent is the reason Wenger has had success. I’ve argued that one for years. Sure, Wenger’s been great for the club but he didn’t do all of that by himself.
Example: What’s the difference between Vieira and Diaby? In my opinion, it’s the influence of Tony Adams and Martin Keown. Vieira was a talented player when he got here (like Diaby) but it was the English influence (and Petit) that helped him see superstar status. Vieira would have still been in the French team, just like Diaby is, but he would never had known the glory that he’s seen without learning about the British grit from a Brit. They let the new kid from Milan know exactly how we do it in these north London streets. Who was there to show Diaby how it’s done? Will he ever truly learn?
This is exactly why you can’t buy the next Vieira. He wasn’t born that way, he was made. I saw him in the Olympics in Atlanta so I know he had the fire, but Adams and Keown showed him how to use that fire. That British influence is why I’ve always called Vieira a hybrid. It’s the secret ingredient that Wenger’s missing in developing his current younger players. These kids can learn but it will take them much longer to hit Vieira-type levels.
This is some crap I made up but I believe it to be true.
May 18th, 2009 at 12:04 am
Interesting isn’t it that Senderos and Flamini are getting game time at AC Milan. I hope they go well.
Thanks for breaking the silence!! Good for you.
I read your linked post.
I agree that the squad could be a winning one with few additions. I’ve never advocated the need for wholesale change. We aren’t too far away. Although where we part company is in the hope that Arsene will address the need. I’ve said a few times that a capable manager (and there are actually quite a few around) could take the squad Wenger has put together – buy a few, sell a few – and win something immediately.
The thing is the type of manager I’m thinking about would make a few changes to the squad and 1st team, but he would also alter the style a bit and introduce a wee bit of defensive solidity – he would understand and respect the need for a spine – for a DM and CB who bring a bit of bite and authority. He would also likely expand our wide game and use the wide open spaces of The Emirates and bring the big strikers in to the game more.
There’s nothing rad in what I’m saying, it’s just that it’s not on Wenger’s cue sheet.
May 18th, 2009 at 12:30 am
Well said, it’s true crap.
It’s like we’re rebuilding from ground-zero, yet we’ve never laid the foundations.
Vieira was overlaid on a foundation. Sure, the midfield was badly wanting, but it’s easier to find your game in a tough team with a structure than a team with little structure.
Wenger came, overlaid Vieira, Petit and Overmars and whacko – a title winning side was born. He expertly saw what was lacking and fixed it. And he then continued tinkering with it for 6 years and maintained a very good team that bordered greatness.
Once that foundation was dis-established it’s become pretty dire stuff.
May 18th, 2009 at 2:54 am
Who was it that said soon the “hippie optimists” will accept reality then come out at their own timing to “lecture” us on their wisdom with attached dripping morality of a “better fan”……LOL!
…. All this even though, we have ALL been saying the obvious ALL season long …. now you put out an attached blog to say the same thing …..LOL!
The whole post and attached blog is HILARIOUS …
May 18th, 2009 at 3:49 am
I think it might have been me that said the bit about it’s only a matter of timing……
May 18th, 2009 at 6:26 am
United fan to a Liverpool one -
“Can anyone remember the last time a team scored more goals, lost less games, beat the winners twice and still didn’t finish first???? Thought not, you know why – because people only remember the winners. Bang!”
Ouch, that hurts !!
May 18th, 2009 at 9:32 am
Just a couple of minor points:
The fan/supporter like the ‘customer’ is always right. The club exists for the supporters and not the other way around.
Berlusconi still has a ‘hard-on’ for Emmanuel (Beyonce) Adebayor and that’s a good thing as far as I’m concern.
Sales of Adebayor, Diaby and Denilson would fuel purchases of a ‘Vidic’ type CB, a ‘Senna’ type DM and either Edin Dzeko (Wolfburg) or Vedad Ibisevic (1899 Hoffenheim) (coming back from anterior cruciate surgery) as a replacement for Adebayor. We may need both CFs if RVP continues to think his season warrants more than 70K per week. After all RVP has scored > 20 goals yet. Walcott was not deserving of his contract either but it is what it is.
Not to pick on Denilson but every Brazilian player named ‘Denilson’ has been a flop in Europe.
May 18th, 2009 at 10:58 am
cpta.
If we all agree that Adebayor, Diaby & Denilson and maybe a few others aren’t going to cut it at the club, why should we expect them to fetch any kind of money in a sale, that would “fuel” a purchase for quality?
The reality is, we will have to spend more money than comes in from selling off players, unless we are selling Cesc. When has Arsenal done that? Not very often. The model has to change, and that is what offends Wenger… that the supporters have had enough of the crazy Wizard’s vision.
May 18th, 2009 at 11:08 am
http://www.football365.com/story/0,17033,8750_5334018,00.html
No surprise to see Arsene missing from the top 10 managers of the year. Agreed, this is a subjective list but I doubt anyone would disagree with Arsene’s absence. This is what it is. Once you set high standards, you are judged by it. Arsene can go on and on about how well we performed from November to March. Unfortunately, the season starts in August and ends in May.
May 18th, 2009 at 11:11 am
No young player is leaving. Arsene is not selling them. They aren’t leave on their own. They get paid well and the pressure to perform is not great either, at least not from the manager.
May 18th, 2009 at 1:00 pm
It’s all about the balance as I’ve read on this site innumerable times. We don’t have it and we won’t go far without it. Hiddinck’s parting words of wisdom to Chelsea were “buy young”. Man U’s model looks pretty good right now where their young are being brought along at a reasonable pace into the fold of their veterans. Our model of ‘throw them in and it’s sink or swim’ without experienced mentors is not working. Who here’s thinks Clichy mentoring Gibbs is ha-ha funny. Even worse is the fact that no one can mentor Song, Diaby, Denilson, Ramsey, Wilshire because they are or will be 1st teamers before their diapers dry out.
Senderos and Flamini will now get plenty of mentoring while getting paid for it.
Just how effective was Hleb in Barcelona’s 2-1 defeat by Malaga: not very.
May 18th, 2009 at 1:10 pm
I like Dzeko but he’s an awful lot like Bendtner. It’s not a shot at Bendtner but I believe adding Dzeko would be redundant.
People have spoken so much about how Nasri is an upgrade to what Hleb gave us last year simply because he’s scored a few goals. The fact is Arsenal were rampant in attack with Hleb pulling the strings. Though he didn’t score much, Hleb created chances by the boatload. Scoring chances were the main thing we were missing this season. Adebayor (and Fabregas) scored a lot of goals with Hleb being the focal point for all of our attacks. Arsenal always looked like they could score. Not so this season with Samir. Nasri only plays for himself, holds the ball too long, and flatters to deceive. I’m not impressed but he’s still young. Hopefully he’ll be better next season.
I think we would be foolish to sell Adebayor. All he needs is service from midfield and he will score goals. Put Arshavin in the hole behind Ade and I guarantee he will score twenty + again. Let Nasri battle it out with Walcott or Traore out wide.
Denilson is only like 21. I wouldn’t call him a flop just yet. The truth is he played a lot of soccer and is simply jaded after a long season. What I will say is he needs to take the offseason and decide how much he wants to be a superstar. While I think he played well most of the season, he needs to come back next season and show a bit more boldness.
Lastly, what if Wenger didn’t really have big money to spend? He tried to sign several players who were either unavailable, too expensive, or didn’t want to come to Arsenal. Perhaps he lacks the charm that David Dein has. Who really knows why Wenger didn’t buy?
May 18th, 2009 at 1:53 pm
Didn’t quite get the timing bit really. I just thought I’d wait till the season gave over fully before I could post. I didn’t even attempt to say something “wise” or “drip with morality”. What same thing did I say? Pray enlighten me.
May 18th, 2009 at 2:01 pm
Thank You JoshuaD. You’ve been pretty much one of the very few objective voices on this board. It is usually quite interesting to read your posts because they talk more football and less opinion.
May 18th, 2009 at 2:36 pm
Josh.
So if you wouldn’t sell Adebayor, Denilson is not a flop, Nari battles it out with Walcott… ummm… what exactly would you change?
It’s obvious something BOLD has to occur. Coming back with essentially the same team, is the equivalent of surrender. We are not winning shit with this team as it is, and will need QUALITY and EXPERIENCE coming in.
I have said that the last 2 years, and we did fuck all or worse (selling players), in the Summer.
If we do nothing major, expect NOTHING from this team. It will be another piss poor dissapointing year.
The same story, the same results, the same excuses keep occuring.
One thing that is good, is that Wenger was apparently riled by people questioning the “plan”… or lack there of…
May 18th, 2009 at 3:19 pm
I think the big change that is coming is that AW departs for Madrid this summer. The vitriol from the shareholders meeting has seemed to caught him completely off guard and his normal comments about other club’s interests are not what we are hearing.
In the past AW has always been adamant that he was staying with Arsenal. However, when he says that managing Madird is interesting (or whatever his exact terminology was), my feeling is he is honestly considering it.
Now all of this could’ve been heat of the moment kind of stuff. Or maybe he really thinks he is not appreciated. Who knows. But I do think that if there is a major upheaval this offseason it will be AWs departure. And if he goes in one year I think you can expect the likes of Cesc to go as well.
Again, just my instincts I have nothing concrete to back any of this up. But that does beg the question – if AW does go – who succeeds him? And no Tony Adams will absolutely NOT do.
May 18th, 2009 at 3:50 pm
Senderos might actually become a decent player after a few years of training from those truly geriatric vets they have at Milan.
As for the Hlebmeister …. his ineffectiveness is never a surprise.
If not for the suspensions and red cards Barca have he would not even be on the bench for the CL final.
May 18th, 2009 at 3:53 pm
Only voices that agree completely with LDE are objective.
Memo received.
May 18th, 2009 at 3:58 pm
The guy should leave. Really.
Tony Adams is a drink loving, lump it, play hard type of guy. He will never make it as a manager.
What we need is a vastly intelligent ex-player, a visionary-type player who is dedicated to attacking Ajax/Barca principles, who is well grounded in Arsenal traditions.
May 18th, 2009 at 4:14 pm
Wenger’s Real Madrid comments are ‘interesting’. Why make them? Because a reporter asked? Well they ask stupid ? all the time, so what. The less than flat out denial can be a ploy on Wenger’s part but to what end? I usually see my contracts out to their end. Uhh! What is Wenger looking to accomplish w/ these tongue and cheek comments. There as bad as Adebayor comparing AC Milan to Beyonce. Is he looking for more transfer money (there’s always funds available for Wenger, he just chooses not to spend), an out pouring of “baby please don’t go I love you so” from the supporters, what, what is the point? If you plan on being an inflexible dolt this summer then be gone. If you plan on making corrections in the Arsenal ‘project’ then stay. Maybe Lassana Diarra will come back when you show up at the Bernabeu
May 18th, 2009 at 4:17 pm
Tony Adams has already become what so many English managers become: recycled retreads. At least McClaren went away and reinvented himself as a ‘foreign’ manager.
May 18th, 2009 at 4:20 pm
Flop was a bit harsh because Denilson has had good games. I was connecting some peoples’ opinions of him w/ the former most expensive player Denilson no.1.
May 18th, 2009 at 4:23 pm
Bendtner is not an awful lot like Dzeko because one is a better finisher and he’s not from Denmark.
May 18th, 2009 at 4:25 pm
Funny isn’t how Hleb can only get a start w/ Barcelona’s youngsters from their reserve team.
May 18th, 2009 at 4:44 pm
Joshuad, you have to remember Nasri scores goals, is direct, is “serious”, he gets “released” by Fabregas etc etc
lol!!!!!!!
May 18th, 2009 at 5:18 pm
Wenger’s just realised he shaved his head last summer and his hair hasn’t grown back.
His responses to supporters concerns have been arrogant, sure he feels on the back foot, but if you spin nonsense all season long what do you expect? He will have lost a swag of swinging voters with his recent superior attitude and inability to acknowledge areas of real squad weakness. I mean, how can anyone point to Rosicky’s absence as being a reason for our position? Only a dumbnut expected Rosicky to contribute meaningfully this season. Is Wenger a dumbnut? Or does he think supporters are, and therefore deserving of ridiculous answers? The only comment you can make on Rosicky is “why didn’t we mitigate his loss at the start of the season”?
Sadly, Wenger is believing his own spin.
With Nasri, I think the lads performances are wholly predictable. It takes a season for a playmaker to adjust to the EPL and at 21 it might even take him longer. He has put in some promising shows but they were earlier in the season – and some forget quickly. Crucially, it’s hard for a young player to come into team that is struggling to find fluency – I said this pe-season – don’t expect a diamond under every rock.
This is one of Wenger’s failings, and I don’t apologise for that term. He has believed/hoped that every ‘call’ he made would come up trumps. Whether it be relying on young players, captaincy choice, poor team balance, poor partnerships, crocks recovering. That was silly, too high risk, and it flumped early in the season and exposed his strategy for what it was – hoping for way too many things would come good.
May 18th, 2009 at 5:48 pm
No need to compare. Both are flops, but at least the older one had some skill, unnecessary skill, but skill nonetheless.
May 18th, 2009 at 5:50 pm
Actually, if you watched him several times you will find they are almost twins when it comes to their style of play. The only difference is starts all their matches for 2 years now, and is the focal point of their attack.
I am quite sure Bendtner will do the exact same thing if in the same scenario.
May 18th, 2009 at 5:51 pm
He is hoping the fans start begging him to stay. LOL.
May 18th, 2009 at 7:55 pm
You’re just not being ‘objective.’
May 18th, 2009 at 8:03 pm
ctpa, I wouldn’t say that Dzeko is a better finisher but I might say that Bendtner finds ways to screw up finishes.
stag133, you’re right that we need some changes but selling Adebayor and Denilson are not going to make Arsenal better. Adebayor has already proven what he can do in this league. What he needs is service. What Denilson needs is time to continue developing. What Arsenal need, same as last summer, is a DM and a CB.
Kiwi, you’re spot-on when you say that Wenger hoped for WWWWAAAAAAAY too many things to work out that were never likely to happen. Rosicky is a perfect example. We went into last season and our most fragile player was the only one who didn’t have cover because Wenger HOPED he would miraculously stay fit all season or HOPED Diaby could convert to winger. I still believe the decision to not have cover for Rosicky is what cost us the league last year because once he went down, so did our consistency and swagger.
Arsene is full of it because he also said that he didn’t know Flamini and Hleb would leave. We were talking about those two leaving as early as last February. If Arsenal America knew they were leaving then how could Wenger not have known it? You know what they say, “if it looks like bullshit and smells like bullshit……..”
May 18th, 2009 at 11:10 pm
Lets just leave it at – I dont think you’re objective in the least. Most of your posts have a few good points but are said with such venom that it gets lost a lot. Anyway rant on.
May 18th, 2009 at 11:40 pm
Sure am not objective. Am sure I was also not objective when I was mostly positive about the balance last season and was only upset only about lack of enough AMs…..and I only turned when the balance was OBVIOUSLY shattered last summer.
Sure! you sir, have the MONOPOLY on objectiveness.
May 18th, 2009 at 11:49 pm
LDE!
Spot on. A few good points lost because of the non-sense. Rant on!
Exactly.
May 18th, 2009 at 11:51 pm
You would need a legitimate manager, with experience and a proven record, in order to keep the best players from departing… especially Cesc, who feels indebted to WENGER, not Arsenal.
May 18th, 2009 at 11:53 pm
Nasri would be nice to have “IN ADDITION TO”, Hleb… and Flamini…
But alas… that would be too much to ask.
May 19th, 2009 at 12:01 am
I doubt he really cares… its his team, and he can make whatever decisions he wants, as long as the board backs him.
May 19th, 2009 at 12:06 am
He probably believed that they (Flamini & Hleb) would stay, regardless of the rumors. He believes his own verbage… so why wouldn’t his disciples?
Proper defense and depth is what cost us the league last year, not Rosicky… is my opinion… defense wins titles. We haven’t had anything close to the best defense in years.
And… I thought we should have sold Adebayor LAST year… and said so… because his value would never be higher. I’d sell him… and do whatever it takes to bring in Tevez if he’s available… or another experienced striker with some passion and preserverance. Ade lacks “it”. He’s good, but not good enough to change games. I’d swap him for Drogba in a moment. I’d even swap him for Anelka!
May 19th, 2009 at 6:34 am
….why did the next post/thread get removed?????
May 19th, 2009 at 6:45 am
I was wondering the same thing …
May 19th, 2009 at 9:03 am
Yup, thought my PC as acting up or something.
May 19th, 2009 at 9:18 am
What was the next post/thread? What was the content?
May 19th, 2009 at 9:45 am
BS. If he didnt care he wouldnt be telling us how upset he is right now.
May 19th, 2009 at 9:48 am
The only “superstars” we have are Arshavin, Fabregas and RvP.
Arshavin and RvP are big time Iceman fans. They will stay.
Fabregas might respect that and stay one season. If he does not, whoopty doo, its not like we have won anything since he got his first team position anyway.
May 19th, 2009 at 9:48 am
LDE’s kool-aid post.
May 19th, 2009 at 10:36 am
The return of Anelka and Henry. The 2 that we should have never let go. The prodigals. Come back to us – all is forgiven!
May 19th, 2009 at 11:36 am
Great to see Setanta and FSC queuing up to broadcast the Stoke game. Maybe we’ll have a defense that can cope w/ another burly-type CF in Fuller and set plays from Roy (have my towels on the sidelines) Delap. Other than wanting Arsenal to get revenge and seeing a run out from Vela among others there’s not much here. Hoping for a blurry stream from anywhere to show the game at 11 EST. Will settle for Man U pummeling Hull. Whatever became of Fabregas’s “spitgate”. FA letting it die a quiet death as it should.
Now this is ha-ha funny:http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=4176082
Kroenke in a steel cage match. Maybe Stan (and his organization) is not the man we hoped for.
May 19th, 2009 at 11:38 am
Lost in the ether.
May 19th, 2009 at 12:01 pm
I would love to see Vela get some real playing time. Wenger’s handling of him has been one of the season’s real mysteries. I’d hoped to see a lot more of him by now. Vela’s one of the younger, raw players who has actually shown at least flashes of what he was (theoretically) brought into to do. But it seems like he fits in more with a Utopian ideal Wenger has, than the squad as currently constituted.
May 19th, 2009 at 12:02 pm
Like Flamini?
If a young player gets a good offer, why wouldn’t he go. He knows he’s not likely to win anything at Arsenal.
May 19th, 2009 at 12:04 pm
It was a bad idea to post that thread on the site as far as Arsenal football discussion goes. Some of it was personal and it would have only instigated a bunch of arguing among a few members. It’s not the first time that the powers that be at AA have removed a thread.
May 19th, 2009 at 12:05 pm
Fred. Bergkamp is not a manager.
He’s not coming to manage a high profile club with zero experience.
We’re a major club, not a science experiment.
But by all means though… keep on with the idea that he is an option, regardless
of how ludicrous it is.
May 19th, 2009 at 12:07 pm
That would never happen under Wenger.
And… I think one of them with a good young powerful striker would be nice.
But don’t hold your breath.
May 19th, 2009 at 12:10 pm
Ummmm. Yeah. Stan fucked up. He had no confidence that his Denver Nuggets could possibly make the Western Conference Finals. That is bad business management at its finest.
I doubt ManU batter Hull. They’d be crazy to play anyone of importance… because Hull will be going all out, and United will be trying not to get injured. Everything to play for – versus – nothing to play for.
May 19th, 2009 at 1:02 pm
“We’re a major club, not a science experiment.”
Someone please tell Arsene.
May 19th, 2009 at 1:38 pm
I don’t know really. Maybe I took out my frustrations a little; but really a lot of it was regarding Arsenal only. It was more a defense of AW despite some of his flaws , more than anything. I pretty much detest “message board banter” anyway so I wasn’t looking to start a fight. Oh well…
May 19th, 2009 at 1:47 pm
I didn’t think it was that inflammatory.
May 19th, 2009 at 1:56 pm
Now I’ve seen everything
May 19th, 2009 at 2:04 pm
I now amend my previous statement – I do not think AW will leave, he was just quoted talking up the next batch up “young guns” – like Wilshere and Coqulin.
It now seems to me it was more of ploy. Warning shot to the board maybe? Who knows.
May 19th, 2009 at 2:41 pm
This was the perfect season to blend Vela in rapidly with Eduardo out due to injury. Vela’s utilization, or lack of it, has been noted here by many AA contributors.
May 19th, 2009 at 2:48 pm
Yeah, he merely said it would be “interesting….”
But as another hippie optimist/Wenger Knows (more than I do and I’m just trying to figure out what the hell he’s thinking….) kinda guy, it was an interesting ploy. I mean are we ready to trade AW and Cesc for Juande Ramos and (as those idiots on GolTV call him) “Lass” (Lassana Diarra)?
IMO fans can do wha
May 19th, 2009 at 3:03 pm
Uh….I think we need that edit feature….
I was gonna say something about fans doing/saying whatever they want. As the team becomes bigger and charges the big ticket prices you gotta expect it. To me it’s been pretty amazing that AW got Eboue and Bendtner to pull it together a bit after the fans got on them, not to mention eliciting the best we’ve seen from William Gallas after stripping him of the captaincy.
I’ve got a whole bit about how I think we’re actually (fairly substantially) ahead of where we were at the close of last season, but I’ll save that for after the last kick, and maybe after I see the uproar caused by other lengthy diatribes from a few of my fellow hippies. Or do such writings just disappear in a sea of negativity
(LDE’s post, which is still available by link above, seemed to bog down the whole home page for me last night. Will it be back up?)
Finally, in preparing my Opus it’d be good to know what others here think of the seasons turned in by the ex-gunners: Hleb, Flamini, Senderos, Gilberto, Diarra, etc. I’ve watched them just a bit but I know others have seen more. Thanks.
May 19th, 2009 at 3:18 pm
I thought the same thing about his comments wanting to get the board to react. In the last few years, the board have come out and said Wenger had money to spend thereby removing themselves from any blame. Wenger and the squad have rightly come under fire for some poor on-field displays but the board isn’t without blame either. The decision to get rid of David Dein has certainly had a negative impact on things allowing Wenger to maintain two jobs in a way and as a result putting the team’s balance off. The only known things about Dein’s departure was that he wanted to bring Stan Kroenke in, something the board didn’t approve. And as a consequence of that, Dein alligned himself with a certain Russian thus paving the path for the board to reconsider that Stan is a better option. By going with Dein’s original plan, the board took about 1.5-2 years to realize what Dein had wanted and in the meantime, the on-field experiments continued. So if Wenger is to be blamed for taking 4 years [or whatever number is valid] to realize the squad was off balance, why is the board not blamed for 2 years of drama that has certainly eroded things? Although consequences could have been worse. Wenger could have left in 2007 and that might have led to a domino effect of further departures on top of Henry’s exit. Henry is also close to Dein’s son and it is said that Dein’s daughter helped in Henry’s move to Barca.
May 19th, 2009 at 3:24 pm
Stag, you brainless comedian:
For the upteempth time, Bergkamp has MORE experience than Guardiola had when he took over Barca. He also has more experience than Louis Van Gaal and Johan Cruyff did when they plunged in. From years of experience, “pitch-mapping” players like him, Guardiola, Pirlo, Baggio, etc. On the other hand if your game was never about “seeing plays before they happen”, then your success is hit or miss.
The exact same positive feeling I had when Van Gaal took over Ajax in 1991 is the exact same I have about Bergkamp in such a role. Bergkamp is not Adams or Shearer or some other random mediocre brain.
All aside, I dont expect YOU to have a clue what I am talking about.
You are still of the belief Aston Villas midfield is top class and Everton will struggle against relegation. LOL.
Stick with that, hombre.
May 19th, 2009 at 3:26 pm
Yeah it gets annoying and comical when Diarra is called “lass” on goltv but that is the name he has chosen to put on his shirt though. Even though there are two Diarra’s at Madrid, Lassana is quite different from Mahamadou. Could Lassana have not been sufficient? Or maybe the guy does not know the english meaning of “lass”
1. a girl or young woman, esp. one who is unmarried.
2. a female sweetheart.
May 19th, 2009 at 4:15 pm
Very well described. I think the whole story of the break between Dein and AW has yet to be told and it is a huge issue at the club. Most likely it revolved around Dein’s insistence on outside money with AW taking an opposite stance, believing that the new stadium revenues and continued CL play would allow us to compete without a “Sugar Daddy.”
Another element which involves Dein that I would like to know more about is his role as head of the G-14. Back when the economy was go, go, go (and Arsenal were moving into a new stadium and playing in the CL final) and TV contracts were going up, up, up, there was some talk about a European Super-League (beyond the CL/European Cup competition). I’ve always thought that the current Arsenal has been “built for Europe.” (a French club team, that just happens to be based in London?) I wonder what Dein and AW were thinking along these lines.
May 19th, 2009 at 5:13 pm
I think the break was between Dein and the Board.
I think we can see that with the benefit of hindsight, Dein was a moderating influence at Arsenal on AW. Dein was visionary at a Board level, he had a vision for making Arsenal FC a top-5 club in Europe – no small dream. As he got to know Wenger he saw how he could play a major part in that vision. He persuaded the Board to appoint Wenger – a massive risk. What then transpired was a fusion between the two men. I think we can see that Wenger has struggled to turn his pure football vision into something substantive without the savvy and pragmatism that Dein offered.
Several months ago Dein said the team needed an infusion of signings – many took this to be a cheap shot at Arsenal per se but I think he was simply stating what he firmly believed from years of involvement in helping managers form winning teams.
May 19th, 2009 at 6:01 pm
Oh. You had a positive feeling about Van Gaal in 1991.
That is PRICELESS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You don’t need to say any more… just tell Arsenal that, and I am sure
they will sign up Bergkamp.
NO COACHING EXPERIECE. DOESN’T FLY.
FRED THE JACKASS has the same positive feeling he had about Van Gaal 18 years ago!
Stick with that you clown!!!!!!!!!!!!
May 19th, 2009 at 6:56 pm
Dein the progressive visionary carrying Arsenal forward. The Arsenal board personified by Hill-Wood singing “let’s do the time warp again”. Arsenal’s players may have play w/ the ‘hand brake on’ at times but maybe the Arsenal board was a ‘hand brake’ that throttled David Dein.
I’ve been thinking about Wenger’s “Real Madrid is an interesting project” comment. When a child brings you their ‘art’ creation, you tell the child that it looks interesting. The child depending on their age will not know what ‘interesting’ means so they will rely on your facial expression and body language for positive feed back. Did anyone see Wenger when he called Real Madrid “interesting”
Seriously when you look at Real Madrid they have a lot more holes than Arsenal. If Wenger goes there the first thing he would do is retire Raul and Van Nistelrooy (remember him). Huntelaar may or may not be a keeper going into his 2nd season. Guti is hit and miss and prone to lose the plot on ocassion. The Dutch MFs Sneijder and Van dar Vaart have been inconsistent and injury prone. Ramos is a better offensive player than defensive player. Lassie has been very good but “size matters”. Pepe will be be back after he’s had his rabies shots and finishes his suspension. Cannavaro was old and slow when we played them in 2006 and he’s lost more steps since then. Higuian is a winner. Robben has stayed healthy for a change and can still be a difference maker. Gago has not impressed me enough to sit up and take notice. Just who is the real LB at Madrid, is it Drenthe, Marcelinho or the Man U reject. Just too many holes for the no. 2 team in La Liga to challenge Barcelona or hold off Villarreal next season.
May 19th, 2009 at 7:36 pm
I will be rooting for Newcastle this weekend. 3 reasons: they are easy for Arsenal to beat, they should not be punished for Ashley’s mismanagement and Villa need to be spanked for daring to think they could ‘claim’ our CL spot.
I will be rooting for Hull to lose because like Birmingham City last season, they don’t have the class to stay up and they tried to f**k w/ my team and no one f**ks w/ my team.
May 19th, 2009 at 7:40 pm
Oops, Cannavaro at 35yo has decided to return the Italian burial ground. Hell if Maldini could last to 40yo you know it’s a slow league where Senderos will do well.
May 19th, 2009 at 8:42 pm
Does anyone really think Real is an option for Wenger? I mean really?
When you think Real do you think….patience, tolerance, long-term vision, aversion to signing stars, autonomous managers, French dressing rooms, happy little cherubs waiting patiently under a 6-year plan before the next trophy pops up? Didn’t think so.
Real and Wenger are not a match either way. They make good print for news coverage….but that’s it.
A club like AC Milan may be a better bet for Wenger. They’re more stable and would provide him with a sound base upon which to overlay a new attacking set of players.
May 19th, 2009 at 10:08 pm
Honestly? Yeah, I actually do. And I don’t think he’d have a hard time adjusting there.
Arsenal plays better against European clubs in the Champions League than they do against English sides in the Champions League because AW knows how to implement finesse style ball better than he understands the rough and tumble side of English football. United can do both. Chelsea and Liverpool can do both. We have a load of talent — but when it comes to the EPL, it’s the gutty/toughness (not to mention a bon a fide field marshall) that we lack.
I do think he’d so better at this point with a European League side than in the EPL. I’m not saying I want him to go — I don’t. But he hasn’t shown the willingness to toughen the squad up with some steely vets. The central defense hasn’t improved since Sol left. And we seem to suffer more injuries than anyone else in the league (could just be that I focus on Arsenal so much that I don’t look at everyone else, but how many of our best players always seem to be game to game?).
May 19th, 2009 at 10:51 pm
Nice one from DannyT.
http://www.oleole.com/blogs/arsenal-truth/posts/arsenal-fans-stunned-by-critics
I loved this line – Never mind Wenger, now the supporters are being made to look as though they’ve “killed someone”.
May 19th, 2009 at 10:57 pm
How long do you think he’d be given at Real? This is a cub that sack managers even after they’ve won trophy’s!
They would like the sense panache that Wenger’s reputation brings but they wouldn’t relinquish the same level of autonomy to him to let him ‘do his thing’. They have a way of operating that every manager bows to. At the same time he’d be under immediate pressure to perform, so even if he thought he could achieve that by his normal approach of buying ‘off-radar’ – forget it! Real exists on a diet of superstar’s.
And if you think the Emirates crowd are impatient and ungrateful – just wait till you get a wiff of Madrid.
Of course Wenger knows all this.
May 19th, 2009 at 10:58 pm
WHERE’S THE EDIT FUNCTION????????????
May 19th, 2009 at 11:29 pm
The Real fans will eat him alive.
I dont get why anybody is talking about this. Its just a sympathy getter for Wenger.
May 19th, 2009 at 11:30 pm
EXACTLY.
Now, we are all focusing the BLAME for the season on the FANS!
It is just incredible really.
May 19th, 2009 at 11:38 pm
Danny articulated the inconsistency in the ‘lack of money’ argument very well.
Frankly I find all this reverse-guilt mind bending a load of nonsense. What exactly are they expecting? Blind allegiance from the catchment of say 100,000 supporters who frequent The Emirates and the 100,000′s of others who follow closely fom afar? A form of football-supporting enuch with their ability to think removed?
This is 2009 not the 1930′s. Supporters have immediate access to information about their club and are well informed. Arsenal FC draws its immediate support-base from a relatively affluent and well educated catchment. They charge top dollar for the product they offer. Supporters know the remuneration levels that the manager and players get – you know, come on, why would anyone
The club needs a dose of reality; they are competing for the entertainment dollar and the allegiance of a discerning public. If you want a Leeds-type parochial Neanderthal supporter then go buy and resuscitate Leeds. It’s going cheap.
Wenger and the Board need to take it on the chin and apply a dose of pragmatism to the lofty ideals. And while they’re at it they need to compare scripts and decide whether they have money or not. And if they don’t, well tell Arsene to prioritise better and to invest in players who can provide an on-field return now – not a potential upside in 6-7 years. And perhaps if we don’t have money we should look at other options like loan deals and contracting older players for no fee like the guy who won Barca the CL final in 2006.
May 20th, 2009 at 12:28 am
Yup that sums things up very well. Like Danny, I too want Wenger to succeed. I miss the old days when Wenger’s Arsenal team played beautiful football and gave Ferguson reasons to kick a boot at his players (or cleverly aiming it at the wall and getting it to angle back at the player
Rafa does not come close to getting that kind of a reaction from Fergie. If things continue the way they are now, then next season Fergie could be retired part time, focus more on his horses & still win the league without breaking a sweat. We need to get back to the old days when Arsenal were such a threat to United that Fergie wouldn’t have wanted to offload even a player on his way down to Arsenal.
May 20th, 2009 at 12:34 am
I have often thought of the last thing you mention — if Arsenal didn’t have money, then can they not take on experienced players on loan for one year? That way they can assess if the player would fit in with the team. If he does, then they can try to sign him. If he is too expensive, then they might have gotten something out of him. But if the player didn’t work out, then they can send him back when the loan was over. Sounds too simple I guess. And lastly, how did Man Utd get that guy on loan for a few months?
May 20th, 2009 at 12:35 am
Not even 3 months. The Madrid fans not only boo but throw things if they are not happy with their team’s play. And if a player or manager dares calls those Madrid fans not real fans for booing, watch out.
Yeah as you say, managers can be gone at Madrid even if they have trophies. And I am certain if one day a manager leads Real to win every single game in the season and lands all the trophies available, he would still be gone. I still remember how Real Madrid were unbeaten under Raddy Antic for the first half of the 1991-92 season. When his Madrid team lost 2 of 3 away trips after the league resumed in January, he was gone because the powers that be at Madrid wanted to bring in Leo Beenhakker and in the end Madrid threw away the title on the last day of the season.
May 20th, 2009 at 12:43 am
Good point about the G-14. Dein appeared to be the only Arsenal board person who seemed to be a voice in footballing matters outside of Arsenal.
May 20th, 2009 at 12:46 am
I will be rooting for Hull this weekend.
So we’ll cancel each other out!
Newcastle need a real wake up call… and going down would be it!
May 20th, 2009 at 12:50 am
The edit function? What edit function?
It was like the LDE posting… it vanished.
(LDE’s post was taken down for what reason?)
May 20th, 2009 at 1:03 am
Like DannyT said, we have money for the likes of 12M Walcott and 5M+ Ramsey. Even 1.6M for some unknown 16-year old goalkeeper from Argentian. Why not more for the likes of 15M Arshavin?
May 20th, 2009 at 1:48 am
Kiwi also mentioned that in the last thread or one before that. The funny thing is I often forget about how much these kids cost. I had no idea that Alex came for 2 million. That annoys me even more.
Wenger cites money as being the factor not to get certain players or that he would have to break the bank. But I refuse to believe that there aren’t players in their mid 20′s in the French, Belgian, Portuguese or even the Dutch league that could not be bought for 5 million (or less) and do a half decent job. The reason I mention these leagues because in case Arsenal feel that by going after someone from England, Germany, Spain or Italy is too expensive. Which it won’t be unless Chelsea, Man Utd or Man City are chasing the same player.
When Pirès was signed by Arsenal, he was 27 and came in for about £6. Although Wiltord was signed for more than double that, he was 26 when he came. This age balance signings have to be restored. Although, I won’t keep my hopes high for June or July. Maybe in mid-august, I might start believing and then as August approaches its end, there might be someone. And hopefully not a soul brother of someone that Ferguson let go.
May 20th, 2009 at 3:13 am
Quotes from Arsene….
May 2009 If we do not deliver in one or two years I will be responsible. It is the most important moment in the life of this club and we have to be strong now and support this team.
Nov 2008 I am always having to answer questions as though we’ve failed. Let’s speak about it in May. I would not exchange my position with any other manager because I believe in our qualities.
Aug 2008 Every season is the season you have to win something.
Nov 2006 Wait until the end of the season before you judge us. This period now is the moment of truth. I am confident.
May 20th, 2009 at 6:01 am
On an optimistic view, maybe Arsene’s threat to join Real is a negotiating posture to force the board to increase transfer funds which will enable him to buy quality players in the summer.
One can hope.
May 20th, 2009 at 10:21 am
Speaking of stupidity.
http://www.setanta.com//uk/Articles/Football/2009/05/20/Prem-Bischoff-on-future/gnid-53694/
Amaury Bischoff now saying unless he is granted regular playing time at Arsenal he will leave in the summer. He goes on to say that it’s not a problem because he is out of contract in the summer and can go anywhere he chooses.
WTF
Firstly, he is an ungrateful wretch. Secondly, what ratinal justification could Arsene have had to sign a player injured for three years, with 1 first team appearance, and was injured when we signed him. Paid his salary, expenses and all medical bills for 5 months before he even made a reserve appearance. He had absolutely no chance of making the first team because of Fabregas, Diaby, Nasri, Denilson, Ramsey, etc.
Is that considered to be frugal? If any other manager in the EPL did that he would have been lambasted.
May 20th, 2009 at 10:24 am
I notice we are not getting any feedback from the AA brass regarding edit function and also new threads which they were providing almost daily.
Does anyone know what is going on?
May 20th, 2009 at 12:38 pm
yeah I thought of that as well. And this is also mentioned above by ThreeSidesLive.
And if that does allow Wenger to buy whoever he wants, then I think those fans who booed Eboue and questioned Wenger at the meeting should be thanked as well. Otherwise, if all was silent and fans kept cheering everything that Arsenal did, then Wenger could not have used anything against the board.
I think the board were also in a comfortable state doing things as they pleased, dismissing whoever they wanted (starting with Dein) and happy with just being in the CL. And no one had questioned or criticized the board. But just one word from Wenger (“interesting”) has suddenly got articles on the web saying that he is leaving. The board might finally wake up and realize they need to change.
Ofcourse, I am also hoping
May 20th, 2009 at 1:43 pm
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/article-1184597/MARTIN-SAMUEL-Even-Simon-Cowell-work-Arsenal-talent.html
Wenger the reconsideration…
This is the first article that clearly states the board has never had any big money for Wenger to spend and therefore all his public statements of faith in young players is not stubborn insanity, but forced necessity.
May 20th, 2009 at 1:48 pm
Bischoff can piss off! Ungrateful twat.
Adebayor’s agent says he’ll meet w/ Wenger next week to discuss his client’s future. His future? What’s that you say, his future? I can’t hear you over all the sound of booing, can you speak up Mr. Coubis?
Adebayor alledgely had a “groin strain” that precluded him from playing last week. At Arsenal that is at least 3 wks on the shelf hence my assertion that Adebayor was done for the season. If he starts or makes the bench this weekend then I will be ‘shocked’ that A) we were lied to and B) it will prove that he was benched last week. Despite the usual claim to put out a strong line up, there will be no point and we can say adios Adebayor. He sure as hell does not make Arsenal ‘s line up stronger, does he?
Minimilist announcement from Arsenal on Eduardo’s revision surgery. The Croatia MD is a more reliable source of information: 2 operations, 1) to remove the screws (commonly done) 2) remove a bone fragment in his ankle which is no big deal.
May 20th, 2009 at 1:50 pm
No edit function is painful.
May 20th, 2009 at 1:52 pm
It didn’t vanish. The content wasn’t worthy of getting posted.
May 20th, 2009 at 2:04 pm
I want Manu U to win the CL final because of the following: http://www.goal.com/en-us/news/88/spain/2009/05/19/1275583/platini-lauds-barcelonas-football-philosophy
Man U can only hope the referee will not be ‘unduly’ influenced by such an unfortunately timed utterance from Blatini. ( notice to bloggers: Blatini is my copyrighted term of endearment. You will be hunted down and prosecuted to the fullest extent the law allows if that term appears in your blogs).
May 20th, 2009 at 2:07 pm
He flies.
Enough said.
I would argue with you further, but after 3 or 4 years of hearing you say absolutely nothing that makes sense, I shouldnt bother.
I will consistently try to beat sense into your head though, because I have lots of time for retarded gorrillas like you.
Lets see who tires first of the name calling, monkey!
May 20th, 2009 at 2:08 pm
If he is making mistakes in his assessments of certain players – standing by individuals who are patently not up to the job – it is probably because he knows he has no option but to keep faith and be supportive.
…my sentiments exactly…
May 20th, 2009 at 2:18 pm
I can list 5 DMs, 5 AMs, 5 CBs and 5 GKs that we could get for cheap (less than 7 or 8 million) that are of a very high quality, that play in the Dutch and German leagues, that are understated, that WILL improve our team.
Most very good CBs cost 5 million on average. Most very good DMs cost less than 10 million.
The idea we would break the bank is completely absurd.
The tragedy is that Wenger used to go after those types of solid bargains when he used to be successful. Now he is pretending they dont exist.
May 20th, 2009 at 2:22 pm
And Wenger relied on Rosicky and Eduardo for this ending season! Hilarious!
May 20th, 2009 at 2:38 pm
Ah, good old Rafa: true to expectations, sounds of spend, spend are already forming:
”We may well break our transfer record, but certainly not Manchester United’s. But it does not matter about the prices, it is doing the right thing and finding the right players.”
Meaning, Rafa might get a player for more than 20 million pounds but under 30 million. But hey, price does not matter when you are chasing the right players, as long as they are under 30 million.
”The next step is to overcome Manchester United, and that is the hardest. It does all come down to the money they have been able to spend, that is the difference.
”If we want to reduce this gap we have to be really good in the transfer market this summer. That can be the difference between winning the two or three extra points that we would need to win the title.
”We do not have that sort of money, so we have to be cute and clever in the market. Then it does not matter if you have money or not.
Cute and clever? Sorry, how much did Torres come for? Is the media forgetting to put decimal points (or putting them in the wrong spots) in the numbers of Torres and other players coming to Liverpool? How can Rafa talk about not having money? He has spent more than 100 million pounds on players.
”When you have a lot of money it is easier because nobody notices your mistakes. For us it is important to find good targets to buy and make ourselves successful.
Hilarious. I am sure Rafa wishes to have more money so that no one can notice his mistakes. One day, Rafa’s blank cheque book (sorry cheque book for multiple players each under 30 million pounds) will run out. And then he will threaten to walk. Until then, let the spending begin.
May 20th, 2009 at 10:33 pm
Well, you either spend to compete with the other big 2, or you will get left behind like Arsenal.
No, you don’t necessarily have to spend 100 million… but United have bought such fantastic depth, that it doesn’t matter much if a key player goes down.
They could sell Ronaldo, and bring in … Ribery? or a few players, and they would still be the best in England, with the best manager…
Liverpool… is getting closer. That’s for sure.